Length: This picture basically says it all...

Yep,another 3 hour wait for 15 seconds of thrill. Seems almost too bad to be true,but sadly it seems to be. I think this is what Jeff warned us about.

Say Jeff,are we close on our idea of a L:TH:TW:B? I'm sure you can't say though.

It's true, you know... Cedar Point fans really are spoiled brats. I really can't believe some of you.

We're talking about a 420 foot tall rocket coaster here. Please, take a moment to sit and imagine yourself poised to take in this launch. Shooting up, (and from the looks of how things are going), twisting around at incredible speeds, grabbing some insane airtime at the top of this thing, and spiraling 420 feet back towards the ground.

20 second thrills, yes. But, damn, what more do you want? A couple overbanked hills so near the end of it, the only thing reminding you that you're not on Millennium Force is the red rails? It doesn't need anything more than what it's delivering.

And I really don't understand how you can complain about the short ride length, and then say you're going to be in line for 3 hours. Did you ever wait 3 hours for Power Tower? They're not rated #1 in capacity for no reason, folks.

"Remember how we followed up Magnum?" --- I was thinking about this one last night. We got two incredible coasters from who was 'hot' at the time, B&M. Now we've got two, back to back from Intamin. Including Millennium Force, it's "Intamin's Three-peat at the Point." I am psyched. You know you cheered on your return to the unload station your first time on Millennium Force. This thing will give you that same feeling all over again.

Stop with the laundry list of complaints and start being grateful for the amazing collection of coasters we have.

..end of rant..
------------------
gravity: down to earth, without the sugar coating.

www.geocities.com/gravityjmb
*** This post was edited by Gravity 10/20/2002 4:18:50 PM ***

Gravity, I agree that there are whiny fanboys out there who won't be happy unless thier 400ft rocket coaster is also 10,000 ft long. Those people ought to be ignored.

However, that doesn't mean that *everyone* who's disappointed in this ride is a spoiled brat. Some of us think we have a pefectly fine speed-and-height machine at the Point, and we don't need another one. Some of us would rather see a smaller rocket coaster with a longer, more unique layout, given the option between the two.

Will I ride this new ride? Of course. Will I like it? Very likely. However, I remain disappointed, because I feel that the money spent on the L-TH-B could have been spent better, on, say, a nice flyer or something along those lines--something unique, a new experience at the Point.

I certainly don't feel CP 'owes' me anything, and there's no doubt in my mind that a height-and-record breaking coaster is a sound financial investment for the Point. But I do think, from my humble point of view, that I would rather see something else. I doesn't mean I won't ride this ride, or enjoy CP just as much as I always have--I just think there were better options out there. Being disappointed doesn't make me spoiled.

Yes,I guess you could say we are spoiled and no,this thing is not going to be 420 feet.

My guess is that the record dispute it is going to settle is drop height against Superman the Escape,currently the tallest "coaster" as they call it, with a 328ft drop,it's speed is 100mph. Yes,the tower there is 400 feet tall,but the drop is only 328. CP has always had an ongoing battle with SFMM about height since we built MF.

The launch speed of 2003 would have to be too great for a 420 foot shot. I say 350-375 tops,it will not go over 400 feet though.

Yes,it has been a good run with Intamin,they have built 3 great coasters and no one here is criticizing CP for it or complaining about the ride. We are simply trying to look realistically at what they are building and not trying to hype everyone up for a 425 foot 120mph ride,it just isn't going to be that big. It is going to be a 2-3 hour wait opening year for a 20 second ride,an intense 20 seconds,but 20 seconds nonetheless. We just may have to accept the fact that the era of 6 or 7 thousand foot rides coming in at CP may be over,these short intense ones may be all they can do now,unless they expand into the parking lot,I just don't see a whole lot of room left for MF type rides anymore.
*** This post was edited by MFJedi 10/20/2002 4:41:30 PM ***

Yeah, and nobody said a ride of MF's caliber would fit, either.

------------------
gravity: down to earth, without the sugar coating.

www.geocities.com/gravityjmb

Correct. And I wouldn't count out a nice and long wood coaster to hit the Point in the coming year.

I am not sure why some people have any negative feelings at all about this new ride. It will be a great adrenaline rush unparalled by any other ride in the world.

Some of us long time fans started seeing a pattern in the 90's of a major ride every two year up through 2000 when we got Millennium. Then after two years we get Wicked Twister, followed immediately by another new coaster.

There were a lot of people disappointed when Wicked Twister was announced. I admit, it didnt seem like the caliber of ride I was used to getting from Cedar Point. After riding it, though, I love it. It's an awesome addition to the park and one of my favorites.

Now, for 2003, we are getting this gigantic speed demon of a coaster and some people here and all over the internet are complaining. You can break it down this way: would you rather have had nothing last year and a 6000 ft coaster this year, or would you rather have two shorter length coasters in a row?

Honestly, it's a two for one deal that I can't pass up on. Cedar Point has never let me down before, and I don't think they are about to yet.

Basically this is What CP Did....instead of building one Big good coaster in one year....they built 2 smaller coasters 2 years in a row...this would probably be a better plan to attract more people. I'm not sayin a 400 ft coaster is small...its small lenghtwise. Both the WT and #16

This techinacally would be the best plan, if the GP hear's...O wow Cp is getting a new coaster, that probably would attract MORE crowds than just one coaster every other year.

------------------
- Dennis
*** This post was edited by Big D 10/20/2002 5:09:48 PM ***

Amen!, Sigma One! Good speech! ;)

Just because there will be a brake run after the top hat dosent mean that that is the end of the ride, the second hill would need to be over 300ft, they may have decided to only go around 200 feet for a second element and the only safe way to do that would be to slow down the train.

The feelings aren't negative and they're not letting us down,that is not what we are saying. When is the last time you got something new and nice and just didn't dream of something a little better. That is all we are doing,is this hard for you to understand? When MF was announced at 310 feet,don't tell me you weren't thinking "Could it have been 350?" This is just dreaming we are doing,yes 350ft at 110mph will be great but it is human nature to always wonder what if.

I'm sure it will be a great ride and one of my favorites,but even Jeff said enthusiasts would be disappointed about 1 part of it,I am one of those enthusiasts. Maybe this is the difference between the fanboys who never challenge authority and kiss the management rear end at each chance and the enthusiasts who aren't afraid to offer some constructive criticism and questions about what they think.

I would much rather have one long coaster than two short ones. Think of it this way. You can wait in line for 2 hrs for MF and ride for 1:30, or you can wait in line for WT & #16 for at least 3 hrs and ride for less than a minute. I'm not complaining, I love WT, and will love #16 too, but I think that one longer one would have been better.

I agree with MFJedi. It's not that we are spoiled or feel CP owes us anything. It's just that the idea of wasting this much potential is somewhat disapointing. I'm going to be there either way because just the 400 ft fall is enough to make me happy, but I would be HAPPIER if it were longer.

Besides, this forum would be boring if it weren't for all the what ifs. When the announcment does come then all that's left to talk about is the construction.

------------------
-Mike

The Fast and the Fearless

Actually I think most people who are negative wish for things to be better, people who are not negative just take what they are given and are just plain happy. Unlike NEGATIVE people who are like "give me this, give me that I want everything, if I can't get everything I make it so that everyone is mad and unhappy by writing about it, like in, ohhhhh, this forum!"
*** This post was edited by Ronald Lidderdale 10/20/2002 5:43:44 PM ***

Crash, you obviously have not seen Xcelerator in action. It stops the train to a crawl within one section of brake track. In fact, when Xcelerator was installed, it had 2 sections of brake fins. However, the stop was so abrupt, the passangers would lunge forward and hit the seat in front of them. Now, obviously Dragster will be traveling much faster, but I can't see it taking more than a couple peices of brake track to slow the train down.

------------------
Jes
Jes's Roller Coasters DJ Jes
Six Flags Worlds Of Adventure 2002 Ride-Ops Crew! Have fun trying to find me!

True, I wasn't singling anyone out, I just read a lot of posts that talk about disappointment. Every is entitiled to an opinion. But in most cases, the disappoint directly stems from whatever that person hyped the ride up to being in their minds. If this describes you, take it for what its worth, if not, then move on to something else that matters.

As to the implications that I am a fanboy who kisses the managements rear end and not an enthusiast who "challenges authority" like you: That was pretty unecessary and you can go to hell.

Guess I touched a nerve.

So many people around here would go to the grave defending whatever CP does. Yes,they probably read this page and I probably won't be on their Christmas Card list but I don't really care. Instead of always going with the establishment, show a little backbone and ask some questions once in a while or voice a little different opinion rather than just agreeing with everything they do.

If they would have put a Mcdonalds there in that spot,you would be showering their rear with kisses too saying how it was such a great idea and the park never ever does anything that people are disappointed with.

This ride is going to have one heck of a trick, and by no means is this going to just be an ordinary tophat. Not only will this thing be over 400ft tall, it looks as though we are going to do some vertical twisting on the way down. If the twisting is true it is going to have a feeling like no other. Twisting straight to the ground would be great. Even if it doesn't twist like this, it's still going to pack a punch. Honestly, overbanks would just drag the ride out and wouldn't add anything to the ride that can be experienced elsewhere in the park. I think people are going to be left with more of a "WOW" factor if this thing ends right after the trick on steriods. People are going to be like "That was great, let's do it again!" If you had overbanks or a longer course just to try and shave off the speed a little, that factor will be diluted and you won't get off with the same "WOW" factor. I'd rather just have the big punch and be done with it. That way I can get back on it quicker and won't have all the "mushy" stuff to still ride. If you want the overbanks, Millennium is just going to be around the lagoon and it will probably have a shorter line next year.

------------------
If you meet me and forget me, you've lost nothing. If you meet Jesus and forget Him, you've lost everything.
*** This post was edited by forcedude04 10/20/2002 6:14:55 PM ***

"Sigma One", I could not agree with you more completely. I was at Cedar Point yesterday and had the privledge to view the latest construction. I am amazed and extremely excited about the insane elements of this ride. I feel when putting it into perspective, yes many people are wanting too much. Look at exactly what we, "as in cedar point enthusiatist", are going to be able to ride next year. This will be the best of the best, parks everywhere else are again going to marvel this ride as they once did and still do for Millenium Force. I can not beleive some of the things people are saying in here. For pete's sake, "LOOK AT WHAT WE ARE GETTING"!!!!

Enough said.

I agree with forcedude04. When I rode MF when it first opened, the only part I could remember about the ride was that massive drop. All the overbanks, hills, and turns were discarded through my disbelief of having ridden the tallest full-circuit (at that time) coaster in the world. So that fact that it'll only be L:TH:B, to me, will just give it more of shock after the ride's over.

------------------
If the roller coaster scared you...

RIDE IT AGAIN!!!