New observation tower

SteveH said:
The front gate was modeled after Disneys iconic Mainstreet, castle, and Epcot golf ball. Most parks have front gates with something. Even the fictitious WallyWorld had its moose ears. And the CP website has used the horizon profile at the top of the site for years. The keyholes are pretty much a gimmick as you can blink and totally miss them while riding. In a few years it will be just another winged coaster.

This is what I was trying to say Ride On 17. Yeah, they are great now, but soon it will be no big deal, just another ride element. I was more talking about a unique kind of ride that has not been out at other parks yet. CP has multiple record breaking roller coasters to this day but nobody pays attention to that anymore because what people look for these days are "first" and sometimes even "most". I think CP just needs a completely new type of ride.

Top Thrill Dragster was nearly a prototype (Xcelerator was first but Dragster was taken to a whole other level.) That didn't turn out so well. People don't care about records.

The vast majority of amusement park goers will go to one of three places: A Disney park, a Universal park, or their local amusement park. Now adding new things (Gatekeeper) can boost attendance, but Cedar Point isn't going to close its doors because of not reinventing itself. People will always go. It's close to home, it's cheap (compared to other vacations), and its not a major week long vacation so no large time commitment.

I think it would be cool if the park acquires the land where the airport now sits. Since it will be closing, I think this would be the perfect opportunity to add a Downtown Disney type area. And this is where we could see the so desired boarwalk. Plus there's even a view of CP's skyline from here. Add a bunch of restautants, shops, arcades, musicians, etc. and this would be the solution for the missing night life of the area. Have a bus service that runs from the hotels, park, and this new area to allow for easy and quick access. I could even see this staying open year round, but at least all throughout CP's operating season. Now I could see Cedar Point becoming a "major week long vacation" that would put it up against Disney and Universal when people want to go to an amusement park to spend several days.

Now guests would have access to so many more things to do. There's Soak City, Challenge Park, Cedar Point itself, the beach, and the new Downtown Disney-like area. It would be a major investment, but I think it would be worth it and would not only attract more people in the regional area, but also even more people from across the country and even around the world. Plus it would be a great area to spend some time, for example, people who spent the day at Put in Bay or Kelley's Island or anywhere else nearby. They could then spend a few hours at this Downtown Disney area.

IMO, it makes perfect sense to add something like this. Sure, it's sort of copying off of other parks, but it's something CP lacks.

With the price of admission + upgrades (FP/FP+) + upcharges (Dinos, Challenge Park, & other fees), it is fairly safe to say that CF is pricing themselves in the same market as Disney and Universal in competing for the consumers entertainment dollar - so it is safe to say they now are the competition. We tend to pick and choose though when the overlap exists and when it doesn't to match our mood. But CF does not offer nearly the number of attractions, nor the quality or uniqueness a Potterland or Carsland does. In the past their competition was Six Flags and smaller parks which lead us to the coster count wars and mantras "Roller Coast" & "Amazement Park". But frankly, those days are over mainly due to the "buy off the shelf" attractions like winged coasters and spinning spires that are quickly duplicated elsewhere. In short, nothing sets CF parks above the others, and we tend to see gimmicks like ride rotation between parks and temporary improvements/"spectaculars", while many of the older attractions see very little of the TLC they deserve just to keep them fresh.
If you were to pay attention to the financial results of Universal or Disney in comparison to that of Cedar Fair, you would quickly realize where Quimet (formerly from Disney) is headed. Yes, the profits are looking better - but to maintain them, you can't just try and offer up things like Luminosity with the competition serving up similar presentations like igNight at Six Flags, 360 Universal at Universal Studios, or any of the several "goodnight kiss" shows Disney offers. At least not at the same gate prices, because the same quality just isn't there.
The bottom line is everyone in the industry wants our business. And Disney / Universal have recognized that you need to have something no one can clone or duplicate. Plus you need to improve it continiously if you return visitors.
Six Flags tried to buy their way to success to beat Cedar Fair and it landed them in bad financial times. Hopefully, Cedar Fair management will realize that the only path to further increasing attendance and profits is to create from within, and to find their section of the "happiest place on earth" everyone wants to visit on a regular basis.

Gatekeeper2013 said:

This is what I was trying to say Ride On 17. Yeah, they are great now, but soon it will be no big deal, just another ride element. I was more talking about a unique kind of ride that has not been out at other parks yet. CP has multiple record breaking roller coasters to this day but nobody pays attention to that anymore because what people look for these days are "first" and sometimes even "most". I think CP just needs a completely new type of ride.

So, you are saying that ANY ride that CP puts in will soon "be no big deal, just another ride element?" Please name anything successful that CP could put in that would not soon be replicated by other parks?

SteveH said:
With the price of admission + upgrades (FP/FP+) + upcharges (Dinos, Challenge Park, & other fees), it is fairly safe to say that CF is pricing themselves in the same market as Disney and Universal in competing for the consumers entertainment dollar - so it is safe to say they now are the competition.

1 day admission at CP is now $90? Ummm, no. They are not pricing themselves anywhere near Disney & Universal. Those parks have "other charges" (Park Hopper, their versions of Fast Lane, etc) as well.

SteveH said:
In the past their competition was Six Flags and smaller parks which lead us to the coster count wars and mantras "Roller Coast" & "Amazement Park". But frankly, those days are over mainly due to the "buy off the shelf" attractions like winged coasters and spinning spires that are quickly duplicated elsewhere. In short, nothing sets CF parks above the others,

Location, location, location. Why drive from Cleveland or Detroit to Chicago or St Louis when CP is closer--and is out in the lake? Why drive from Raleigh through Charlotte to Atlanta, when Carowinds is right there?

Except for Knotts & Dorney, LOCATION is what sets CF parks (and others' regional parks) "above the others."

SteveH said:

and we tend to see gimmicks like ride rotation between parks and temporary improvements/"spectaculars", while many of the older attractions see very little of the TLC they deserve just to keep them fresh.

Six Flags tried and went bankrupt. CF (and, now, even SF) does not employ that strategy. Want proof? Knotts & Dorney have had strong local competition since CF has owned them. No "gimmicks" but plenty of TLC.

SteveH said:
If you were to pay attention to the financial results of Universal or Disney in comparison to that of Cedar Fair, you would quickly realize where Quimet (formerly from Disney) is headed. Yes, the profits are looking better - but to maintain them, you can't just try and offer up things like Luminosity with the competition serving up similar presentations like igNight at Six Flags, 360 Universal at Universal Studios, or any of the several "goodnight kiss" shows Disney offers. At least not at the same gate prices, because the same quality just isn't there.

Except they HAVE increased profits--as you point out. The wing rider in Chicago does not seem to have hurt profits in Cleveland/Detroit/Sandusky. 360Universal in Florida does not seem to have hurt Canada's Wonderlands' attendance.

Not to mention CF does not charge $90/day.

SteveH said:
The bottom line is everyone in the industry wants our business. And Disney / Universal have recognized that you need to have something no one can clone or duplicate.

Except everything can be duplicated. Universal Studios Florida begat Disney MGM Studios in Florida. Magical World of Harry Potter begat Cars Land (or vice versa ;))

Assuming a quality product--not a 100% unique product--location is what differentiates parks.

SteveH said:
Plus you need to improve it continiously if you return visitors.
Six Flags tried to buy their way to success to beat Cedar Fair and it landed them in bad financial times. Hopefully, Cedar Fair management will realize that the only path to further increasing attendance and profits is to create from within, and to find their section of the "happiest place on earth" everyone wants to visit on a regular basis.

It seems to me that is what they have been doing--at 1/2 the "sticker price" or gate admission of Disney ;)

CP could put in something like the Black Diamond or Flying Turns at Knoebels, they have the resources to complete what this small family run park is attempting. They could also open the history book and look at what Kings Island did in the past. They filmed a TV show (Brady Bunch) on KI property, had a record motorcycle jump made in the parking lot, and built "The Beast" from within their own ranks. All of these are innovative ideas, and as of yet unduplicated.

One Day admission at CP is at least $45, FL/FL+ will add another $50 to $65, Visiting Dino will add $5 ($45+$50+$5=$100), not to mention Challenge Park is an al-la-carte menu. Disney and Universal are at $90 for pretty much everything, and if I buy a park hopper, I get to go into another entire park - something CP doesn't offer unless I want to drive to say - KI.

Location is but one factor in determing where to go for a family vacation in many cases. From Detroit (the biggest city in the area), a family has Chicago, Sandusky, Santa Claus Indiana, Muskegon, and Cincinnati to choose from all reacable within a day. Each having a theme park that offers up pretty much the same mixture of attractions.

The TLC that is missing is in providing what the unhyped areas of the park badly need. One year it's Skyhawk, then it's Windseeker, then it's STR. But when they go down - it's don't look over there, check out Gatekeeper! I would be impressed if they would just power wash the gum off Raptor's walls in the stairway queue and fix the burned out lights on many rides. These improvements alone would be worth a gate price increase because you would never find this sort of condition at Disney.

Increasing profits in the short term does not equate to a long term reason to return or purchase a season pass for many. The Eisner period at Disney prooved that extremely well. A night show like World of Color is always changing. Constantly introducing new ideas like the tie-ins of the blinking mouse ears that match the show. These really add to the overall experience, and of course, the bottom line profits. It's a simple idea - but who else is doing anything like that?

Everything can not be duplicated. CF isn't Disney, and Disney isn't Universal, nor will it ever be, nor do we want it to be. But CF and most regional operators are offering up whatever B&M, Intamin, and others have to sell, and that's a shame because they really could do much more if creativity was encouraged more at CF.

I am not saying that it would not be replicated in the future, I am saying that they should not replicate something else. I think CP should come up with something brand new and be able to say "We have the first ________" I am also not saying that whatever they add is going to be terrible, in fact almost all of what CP addis is fantastic. I just think it is time for change in the theme park industry and designers should think farther outside the box of what they do now.

^Cedar Point has done that before (Magnum anyone) but for a regional park with limited budgets and resources replication and duplication of rides is what works best for them. What is so wrong with it? I think every amusement park has a ride that has been replicated of duplicated somewhere else. And to the original post I would love to see another tower ride at the park but one that actually gives you some time at the top to really take in and enjoy how beautiful CP really is.

SteveH said:
They could also open the history book and look at what Kings Island did in the past. They filmed a TV show (Brady Bunch) on KI property...

Couldn't agree more. On our last visit, as we were leaving, my Wife turned to me and said "I had a decent time, but this place could really use some more Florence Henderson."

SteveH said: They could also open the history book and look at what Kings Island did in the past. They filmed a TV show (Brady Bunch) on KI property,

They did film that "amazing" movie 'Close Encounters of the Fourth Kind' at Cedar Point...

=)

Back to thoughts of a new observation tower.... Though I think Cedar Point will add other attractions first before an observation tower, If they ever do, I hope it is like the proposed 650 foot one in Las Vegas WITH A ROLLERCOASTER ATTATCHED... See Screamscape.com I don't have the link to the exact post but it was posted today...

www.usthrillrides.com/products/polercoaster

I don't know about ride itself, but that guy standing outside the railing on the observation level in the animation (@ the 1 minute mark), concerns me.

Looks like he's going to jump! Then again, it might only be Florence Henderson or an alien from that 4th Kind movie.

In the words of Pointguru

Management doesn't want another tower because of the fast pass sales would be affected if people didn't ride windseeker for the same view...lol

^Haha that's great.

But I could see the park putting one of these in...if they're willing to cough up the money for it.

I believe the US Thrill Rides towers are the same towers S&S is marketing. The Poler Coaster tower is nice, but I would love to see the 1000' version of the Skyspire at CP, with a restaurant/bar at the top: http://www.usthrillrides.com/products/skyspire/

Cedar point need a new observation tower where guest can just take an elevator & enjoy the view of the park as long as they wish & have a place where people can take some pictures of the whole park. To have a place where picture taking is allowed. It would be nice if cedar point puts one in next year.

It'd be awesome if CP got something like Eiffel Tower at the former Paramount parks. It's cool to be able to walk around, take pictures, and spend as much time as you want up there.

Kings Island has a one-third scale replica of the Eiffel Tower. The coasters in Paris must be HUGE!

This topic is only three years old, but it's better than creating a new topic. After visiting Carowinds earlier this week, I noticed how simple their observation tower is. It only stands 230 feet, but it shows great views of the park. Do you guys like the idea of another observation tower in the park like the one at Carowinds? I still think you could squeeze it in behind Power Tower. Power Tower hardly ever uses the queue space they once used when it was brand new.