New observation tower

Makes me wonder where Lance from Screamscape heard this rumor then?

Email him. He posts nearly everything he gets from everyone. I really had him going about Gatekeeper's name just for fun.

Try it.

And how do dark rides not cater to all ages? They even cater to my 2 year old.

A new dark ride would be fantastic. It would make the park complete.

I don't see another observation ride like Space Spiral going to the midway. But, like I said earlier, how awesome would an S&S tower with a restaurant and bar be in Challenge Park? What a great view while dinning or drinking.

A nice Sally ride would be a great addition. They seem to be popular at other parks and are a great ride for children and adults to ride together.

Make it a two-story installation like Indiana Beach has and reduce the footprint.

If only there was someplace at Cedar Point that they could put one....someplace not being used right now for a ride or attraction....maybe somewhere around Game Day Grill and Blue Streak....

djDaemon said:

To say nothing of the fact that two rides targeting the same audience in one year would be a bonehead business decision.

Speaking of douchebaggery. Someone please explain to me why it is a bonehead business decision to add 2 attractions for the same audience in 1 year; but, it is a good business decision to remove 4 attractions targeting the same audience in 2 years. Oh, by the way, it is the same audience the park professes to be trying to attract more of.

I love Gatekeeper. The park hit a homerun with its addition. It adds a much needed lift to the front of the park and beachfront. It sucks Space Spiral and DT had to go and they had seen their time. Luminosity and Wildcat are a wash to me. Dino's alive is the biggest waste of the space the park has done possibly in the history of the park. It is not unique and waste valuable real estate that could be put to much better use. I know it makes money for the park and families seem to like it but the upcharge and multiple other locations of virtually the same exhibit detracts from its appeal for a lot of families.

I will say it again. I love Pete's idea, especially outside the park. I could see it right on the tip of the peninsula with some type of lighthouse theme. If the park isn't planning on getting rid of Dino's alive at the end of its contract I could see a dark ride being added just on the outside of the exhibit with some sort of prehistoric trip through time theme to compliment Dino's.

2 family attractions in the same year probably never would happen but the park need to do something to introduce more family attractions quickly.

For one thing, taking out a ride (or 4) costs less than putting one in :)

For once, I must agree with PointGuru.

I have had the idea for a while now but instead of a dark ride, adventure island into a prehistoric kilamanjaro safaris. Get safari vehicles or even use the same system as turnpike cars, Cadillac cars, antique cars and let the public drive around the Dino's. take away the $5 up charge and this ride could be a hit.

Unless the "Jurassic Park" people make you pay royalties--it would be a pretty clear rip-off.

Captain Hawkeye said:
For one thing, taking out a ride (or 4) costs less than putting one in :)

I like that you added the happy face because while it is a valid point it is also obvious. Not a holistic view; but, obvious. Maybe that is why some many people have problems with my post because they are not looking at the big picture. It would be cheaper to just tear down all the rides and not replace them with anything and just build condos. Of course that hasn't worked out real well for the Geauga Lake property either. Lets just hope the park does as good of a job as they did with Gatekeeper and the next attraction or two are family oriented.

"Someone please explain to me why it is a bonehead business decision to add 2 attractions for the same audience in 1 year; but, it is a good business decision to remove 4 attractions targeting the same audience in 2 years."

I would explain it to you, but my thoughts and opinions are too well thought out for you to dispute.

"I know it makes money for the park and families seem to like it but the upcharge and multiple other locations of virtually the same exhibit detracts from its appeal for a lot of families."

Make up your mind. Either it's profitable and families like it or the upcharge and multiple installations means families don't like it. I will give you kudos for contradicting yourself in one sentence.

The PointGuru said:
Someone please explain to me why... it is a good business decision to remove 4 attractions targeting the same audience in 2 years.

I don't believe anyone claimed that to be the case.

I think he's saying it was implied not claimed. I kinda of agree with PG on that single thing alone.

I still don't see where anyone implied removing several similar attractions was a smart move. In fact, those actions were quite widely criticized here at the time.

It wasn't implied, claimed, or hinted at.

From my memory, the removal of PWE, especially, was met with a chorus of boos, as was Wildcat. I believe the spectrum went from "this is stupid decision" to "I don't like it but I understand it".

The PointGuru said:

I like that you added the happy face because while it is a valid point it is also obvious. Not a holistic view; but, obvious. Maybe that is why some many people have problems with my post because they are not looking at the big picture. It would be cheaper to just tear down all the rides and not replace them with anything and just build condos.

1) Wildcat was torn down and replaced by Luminosity. I'll let others debate whether it counts as a "family" experience, but certainly it has no minimum height :)

2) Paddle Wheel Express was replaced with Dinos Alive--very much a family experience.

3) Space Spiral & Disaster Transport were replaced with Gatekeeper.

The "holistic" view: Rides that have been removed have been replaced, not with condos (:)), but with other rides. And there has been a slight shift toward "adult" rides, but not a significant one. Between Luminosity (and its attendant concession stands) and the Dinos upcharge, the trend is toward more revenue generating experiences.

Many of you may not agree, but I think CP has done a great job over the last few years. They looked at not only ridership but also maintenance costs of rides like PWE and determined they were no longer suitable for operation. Additionally, they've added and removed an even mix of family and thrill attractions over the last few years. For example, STR was coined as a family ride in 2010. Windseeker, which was their attempt to replace SS, is a mild thrill ride. Dinos Alive is a family/children's attraction, Luminosity is a show for all patrons, and GateKeeper goes back to the thrill category. So yes, they have removed some rides that may have skewed that balance, but those rides will someday be replaced, just not the year after their demolitions. They are doing the right thing in putting in thrill rides and roller coasters because people don't go to the roller coaster capital of the world to see kiddy kingdom.

The real issue here is that CF is barely keeping up with their competition. Somehow they feel that Disney and Universal aren't in the same market for their cutomers. Especially now that most of the family run parks they had to go against now are defunct or closed (Boblo, GL, and others). Those parks HAD to innovate and get creative or no one would come year after year. Which is also the likely reason most are gone today (because you can't do it succesfully on a limited budget every year). But with chains like Six Flags or CF, you are working with multiple properties - and a lot more capital to work with than any mom and pop business. So the justification for an internal creative group that can create (rather than just buy) makes a lot more sense.

The management decisions at CF certainly aren't breaking new ground by any means - as several of you are doing the add one / subtract one math to equate removals and editions of attractions. Balance is the best you can achieve with that argument.

Prices overall are going up everywhere in the park. Which is reflected in preferred ticketing (FP/FP+), staying on property to get perks, or upcharge attractions - all cost you more $ just to get what your feel you have to have.

As an example, Disney added an entire park (Cars Land) without eliminating another one. Avatar Land will also see an expansion to their Animal Kingdom without removal of something else to compensate, and the quality of Disney food is a better value (at least, according to another discussion thread on this site). I don't mind the Disney gate price going up, because I can see the improvements going on and the added value.

What CF has to do is find a new void to fill. Once it was the most thrill rides (but SF, now has that title). They aren't a Disney or Universal, so forget the immersive theme park idea. And, as long as you follow the industry trends of winged coasters, tower rides, and goodnight shows - there isn't an advantage over the competition anywhere.

CF really needs to realize that they have to engineer something new and compelling from inside their ranks if they want to stay ahead and compete.

I think that CP needs something new and unique. Something no other park has. They have a large variet of rides but you can find almost all the flat rides and thrill rides at other parks. I have no idea what this new unique idea could be, but I am positive that CP will be able to come up with something, after all, hey were crazy enough to even attempt building a 200 foot roller coaster.

^But don't forget about the uniqueness of GateKeeper. What other park can say they have a record breaking wing coaster soaring over its front gate? Yeah, other parks have this type of coaster and I'm sure many others will in the near future, but the keyholes and entire front gate area/first impression is special to Cedar Point. The whole project 2013 turned out to be one of the coolest and most memorable projects the park has worked on.

The front gate was modeled after Disneys iconic Mainstreet, castle, and Epcot golf ball. Most parks have front gates with something. Even the fictitious WallyWorld had its moose ears. And the CP website has used the horizon profile at the top of the site for years. The keyholes are pretty much a gimmick as you can blink and totally miss them while riding. In a few years it will be just another winged coaster.

SteveH said:
The real issue here is that CF is barely keeping up with their competition. Somehow they feel that Disney and Universal aren't in the same market for their cutomers.

Wouldn't that mean that they're not competition? I agree that there is overlap, but what exactly are they supposed to "keep up" with?

The management decisions at CF certainly aren't breaking new ground by any means - as several of you are doing the add one / subtract one math to equate removals and editions of attractions.

If you really think that, you're not paying attention... to the management or the financial results. The whole "per cap up, attendance down" trend stopped the day that Ouimet took over.