Gas at $3.25,will affect attendance

Jeff, you need to think outside the scope of Cleveland and Toledo. People do have a right to complain, (believe it or not) especially if they are making out of state trips. Now some would argue that and say: don't make the trip. But just because gas prices go up doesn't mean we all need to stop traveling.

From Cleveland and Toledo, the price of gas doesn't effect you as much, for a trip to CP, however, last I checked, a LOT of attendance comes from out of state. Those people do have a right to complain.

myself, i cat really complain because i live in PA and its only about 160 miles each way and it usually only takes about a tank and a quarter (14.5 gallon) to get there and back. Its a really short trip compared to some people that go to the point so about 40 bucks of gas and im on my way.

^^^What about the people (Me) who have the economy 30mpg car, and still struggle with gas prices.

Yeah, I know I can stop buying all that fast food, But I have to eat too. (And then the kiddies a Mickey-D's will loose their jobs because I ain't spending my money there)

I got rid of my SUV when prices jumped to $2.00 a gallon, I was hoping gas wouldn't get over $2.75 a gallon, that's what my budget allows for. . .

Oh well, I'll find a way to get there...

i will be making the trip this year in a little 4 cylinder sunfire. a 2.0 engine is really economical on gas.

mk - I'm coming from Grand Rapids. Its about 526 miles round trip, and at 25 MPG (low end for when I'm doing mostly highway) it'll only cost 6 bucks more to do the trip.

Is it more? Sure.

Is it worth complaining about? Not really.

I'm more upset about the cost that it adds to my everyday expenses, that's where it hurts more. Not on my vacation costs.

*** Edited 5/3/2007 3:09:09 PM UTC by JuggaLotus***

And that's what really matters, John, is the everyday increase in costs. Of course a single trip to CP from SE MI isn't going to be out of reach based on the higher gas prices, but when you combine that increase with a substantial increase in everything - from daily driving costs to retail increases, it adds up quite fast. All of this is magnified by the economical situation in one of CP's key markets.

mk522 said:
Jeff, you need to think outside the scope of Cleveland and Toledo. People do have a right to complain, (believe it or not) especially if they are making out of state trips.

That's not what's driving up gas prices. It's people living 30+ miles away from where they work and driving gas hogs to get there. I have zero sympathy for anyone who complains in that situation, to say nothing of the per capita carbon and pollution they're dumping into the atmosphere.

^ Agreed, they knew their automobile would use gas faster than other cars. I usually as what kind of car they are driving when I hear people complain about gas prices, because they should have know what they were getting into, especially in this time of age.

I don’t see the deal, why do people believe they need these massive 6, even 8-cylinder engines when a 4-cylinder will get you from point A to B in the same amount of time? Sure, some people need the power for hauling and towing, but the average person only need to get around. I really want to get a Hybrid car but I can’t afford to go that direction just yet. It usually takes me about 3/4 tank of gas to make one Cedar Point trip, so I know what exactly how much it will likely cost (Around $30 for a trip).

I don't see the problem with people driving what they want to, whether its a 4-cylinder hybrid, an 8 cylinder 4x4 pickup or a 12 cylinder sports car. It's their choice, whether they "need" it or not.

You've got a lot of room to talk, Jeff. I mean, how much fuel does that helicopter use, anyway?

^ I don't agree. People should be given a choice, but there should also be limits imposed, if people can't see the bigger picture on their own. There's no need for someone to drive an H2 20 miles each way to work, by themselves. And, sadly, 90+% of the time I see a Hummer, Suburban, Escalade, etc, there's one person in the car.

Most of the bigger gas hogs already pay a premium at purchase. Found this out when pricing a Viper (I can dream can't I). There was a 3,000 "gas guzzler" tax added on to the purchase price.

Secondly, my Dad has always driven an SUV/Pickup (at least for the last 10-15 years, we had a stretch where he had a mini-van). He has it because he has a full size trailer that he tows for vacation. Currently, the cost of getting a third car for him to drive to work and back outweighs the cost of gassing up the truck (which he got a Chevy hybrid this last time). So seeing someone driving those vehicles solo doesn't mean they don't have another reason for having made the purchase.

And what bigger picture is there? That gas prices will climb as long as we don't build new refineries and allow foreign countries to provide us with oil? What about the part of the picture that shows the US is sitting on 3 of the largest stockpiles in the world (Alaska, Rockies and Gulf of Mexico)? We could EASILY provide ourselves with enough oil to cut off the Arab states.

djDaemon said:
What about high gas prices, combined with a terrible economy?

Terrible economy lol are you serious? Wall Street just reached all time high numbers yesterday, unemployment is low, interest rates are moderately low, and inflation is very low.

Yes maybe in Southeast Michigan and Northwest Ohio things aren't as great, but overall our economy is quite good.

BGRooDoG said:
I don’t see the deal, why do people believe they need these massive 6, even 8-cylinder engines when a 4-cylinder will get you from point A to B in the same amount of time?

While that is true. Many people bought these huge SUV's in the late 90's and early part of this decade when gas prices were anywhere from $.79 to $1.50. Don't know if you keep up with the automobile industry or not, but SUV's and trucks aren't selling like they used to. Matter of fact, lots are sitting on the lots.

Thats another reason why Southeast Michigan's economy is so bad. GM and Ford all invested very heavily in the late 1990's on the development of these vehicles, while Toyota and Honda invested in cars. Now that trucks aren't selling, look who is making the profits, both Toyota and Honda.

Why would I go buy a GM Buick with the same V6 engine, 2 valves per cylinder, same 4 speed transmission, same everything that has been used over the past what, 20 to 30 years? When I could go buy a Toyota with a V6, 4 valves per cylinder, and a 6 speed transmission that has just been developed. All of these things make for a much smoother ride, better acceleration, better top speed, better breathing engine, you name it.

^^ With regard to the guzzler tax, I think it should be higher, or apply to more vehicles, or both. Based on how often I see 6000 lbs of steel carrying 120 lbs of human, people are too willing to pay for that "privilege".

Now, having grown up with camping being a very large part of my life, I understand that certain vehicles are needed for certain situations, such as towing a camper. However, a pickup truck would be more suited for such an application, given that it not only does a better job of towing, but also because it gets "better" gas mileage when not towing, as compared to an SUV.

^ Well, aside from the fact that Wall Street's health has little to do with the true health of the US economy as it applies to individuals, nothing you've said has any relevance. We're discussing gas prices and how they might impact CP's bottom line. As such, the economies of MI and OH are relevant, while the overall economy of the country is not.

And, no offense, but your view on why the automotive industry is in such poor shape is not only flawed, but not based on reality.

*** Edited 5/3/2007 4:48:09 PM UTC by djDaemon***

Yes, terrible economy for decent paying jobs. Hoover just shipped out the last of it's jobs here in Canton to overseas. 1,000 more people, unable to find a job with a living wage & w/o health care insurance. Not good. And it's not the current administration that is responsible. This, shut-it-down, pack-it-off, mentality has been reeking havoc on America's economy for quite some time. I would like to see a study of unemployment that considered the quality of the employment, not just if someone has a job.

As for the SUV's, no they are not being bought like before at all. My cousin just had to shut down his Chevy dealership after over 80 years of successful business. All the good jobs lost in our area over the last 10 years killed him & many other businesses. I love my SUV, bought because we needed to haul a work trailer at the time, but I couldn't sell it for a decent price now if I tried.

Drum roll.......100!! Official geek!!

Edit: ^ a family of 4 c/n fit in a pickup & we c/n afford to buy a truck that also didn't serve both needs :)
*** Edited 5/3/2007 4:56:26 PM UTC by Good Grief...***

For most people though, the pickup isn't as useful "every-day" as the extra row of seats or the accessible cargo space. There's a reason my dad keeps a hockey stick in the back of his truck and everything he carries in milk crates.

And since Michigan (one of Cedar Points key drawing areas) is going through a one state recession (which is Engler and Bush's fault) DESPITE the markets gains over the last few years, I'm going to say that Wall-Street isn't accurately reflecting our local economy.

djDaemon said:
And, no offense, but your view on why the automotive industry is in such poor shape is not only flawed, but not based on reality.

Then why exactly is the automotive industry in poor shape?

There are a lot of reasons (health care, unions, trade, etc), though I'm not sure that discussing them is appropriate here, considering that we're talking about causes that date back a few decades.

Jeff said:
It's people living 30+ miles away from where they work and driving gas hogs to get there. I have zero sympathy for anyone who complains in that situation, to say nothing of the per capita carbon and pollution they're dumping into the atmosphere.

EXACTLY.

Ding ding ding! Commuters that live in even different counties that "like their homes" and don't want to sacrifice anything at all. *** Edited 5/3/2007 6:45:56 PM UTC by cedarpointr0x***

JuggaLotus said:
And since Michigan (one of Cedar Points key drawing areas) is going through a one state recession (which is Engler and Bush's fault) DESPITE the markets gains over the last few years, I'm going to say that Wall-Street isn't accurately reflecting our local economy.

Its Engler and Bush's fault that FIVE YEARS after Granholm was elected there are problems? Ha, right...

How about its the Big 3's fault for not making more fuel efficient cars! If they had been a Toyota 5 years ago, they'd be LEADING the pack- Michigan would have JOBS available.

But no, GM/Ford/Chrysler decided to squeeze every ounce of profit until no one wanted another SUV. *** Edited 5/3/2007 6:47:36 PM UTC by cedarpointr0x***

^ <shakes head> Where did you get that info from?