Dick Kinzel's Revenge! (Shot Glass size Free Water Cups)...

But if they make the free water cups a bigger (say 16 oz) size, does that make the pop/food better or more affordable?

No, but it removes the argument that the reduction in the size of free water is a scheme to get you to buy more product.

But that argument is just a distraction from the bigger issue, that food and drink prices are too high for the quality/service that is delivered.

If you make the free water cups bigger, it doesn't fix the price/quality issue. But if you fix the price/quality issue, the smaller free water cup doesn't matter.

How is that still not a plan to get you to purchase more product?

Say you have just finished lunch at a new reduced rate. You had the big drink, the fries and 3 chicken fingers. Now you're about to head over to line for Millennium Force. Its 80degrees and you want a water to go with that average 45 minute line. You head over to a stand and you ask for a water. You can take the bottle for a reduced price of $1.95 or the free tap water. You choose tap and get handed a Dixie cup. Well, thats not going to last in the line is it, you can't nessecarily share that with your girl, can you? So you slap $1.95 down and go about your business.

The plan still works even if they lower the price a significant amount. The consumer still ends up buying the larger product.

What if the ACTUAL reason for giving you small cups of water is to discourage folks from drinking too much in line resulting in folks dropping out to use the restroom and increase the line jumping complaints?

Could it be that Kinzel and the gang are just trying to address a more prevalent complaint - line jumping?

:-)

N3rd...you are right. I CAN go park somewhere further away for less than $20 at Landshark Stadium. And, you can drive out to McDonald's and get yourself a super extra large soda for less than $2...or drink water from a water fountain.

What if the real reason for the small water cups are simply that they cost less to purchase? I think the Paramount Parks purchase and the resulting massive debt and resulting massive cost cutting is showing up in a lot of places in the park.

Remember the cheeseburgers from a few years ago? 1/3 pound beef patties that tasted pretty good. Now you get basically all bun with a small, thin beef(?) patty that does not taste nearly as good as the previous 1/3 pound patties. All for the same price or more. I wouldn't mind paying $8.00 for a $6.00 cheeseburger, but I do mind paying $8.00 for a $2.00 cheeseburger.

Most telling is a conversation I overheard where a lady said "I like the rides here, but they charge Disney prices for everything without the Disney quality".

Even during this recession, the guests coming to the park seem to have money to spend as the per cap spending only decreased $.95. But, in years past you would spend money and walk away satisfied. Now, you spend money and walk away feeling ripped off. That is a big problem.

"What if the real reason for the small water cups are simply that they cost less to purchase? I think the Paramount Parks purchase and the resulting massive debt and resulting massive cost cutting is showing up in a lot of places in the park."

Now people are asking for more than 1 cup, so the cost for cups will be more then what they were paying before.

People are paying much more at cedarpoint than what Disney is charging for anything. And the quality of the slop they serve at cedarpoint, does not even come close to what Disney is serving.

Example... http://allears.net/menu/men_cr.htm

I figured the new cups had something to do tracking costs as RideMan suggested way back at the beginning but a new thought came to me. Could Pepsi have anything to do with this?

I have a number of comments, so I may ramble.

First the high food prices are the core of this whole conversation. I was one of the first to complain about the water. The water is just a piece of the puzzle I got the bigger cup and then the smaller one the same day. Yes, the water is free, but shrinking the size just comes off as cheap regardless of the intent. They say little things mean a lot. And this is a little thing for sure, but it's still cheap. Shrinking the cups just doesn't put a check in the plus column of the customer relations scoresheet. If times are tough for CP's business they should be doing more little jestures to make the quest experience a positive one. This doesn't regardless of 5% of the quest know about free water of 85% do.

Here's a small list of other things that qualify as cheap, and this is more in regard to the fast food industry:

-Charging for one BBQ sauce for chicken nuggets at McD's. At least the last one I went to.

-Fast food resaurants that don't place napkins and condiments out for the customer to take and then hand you two napkins and two packets of ketchup. Then you have to ask for more and they give you two more packets. I understand people probably take more than they need and that adds cost to the restaurant. I don't like to have to go back to the counter and wait for more if I need it.

-People like me that ask for no ice in their drink. That's me. I want the drink not a cup of ice. Wendys is famous for giving you a little bit of drink with your ice. The drink is cold to begin with and if you take it to go, you run out of pop and can't get a refill.

Speaking of refills I ducked into the Challenge Park Subway Sunday while waiting for someone. I went in to check the prices for the fun of it. I'm easily amused. The pop machine has a sign that said "No Refills" in bold letters. The menu was amusing too. At the the top of the sandwich list they proudly proclaim "Make it a Foot Long for Only $6.50 More". Whoopee! What a great deal. I the 6 inch prices varied from about $6 to maybe just under $8.

Kings Island still gives out bigger cups.

From my observation yesterday, CP at some places was giving out the bigger cups and some the smaller. The smaller and fine, but small. Just go back and get more or ask for two.

My feeling, based on having run a restaurant in the past, is that those who are not buying something need to stay out of the way of those who are. All you are doing is making it more difficult for those who are actually trying to support the park, financially. If you can't afford to pay the prices for items in the park, that are still lower than many other venues, go use the drinking fountains. Let those trying to purchase their items without you delaying or discouraging them from doing so.

In this economy, they need every penny they can get if we want them to continue making improvements or new additions to the park.

Bought a medium popcorn at the local theater a week ago...$6.50! A large pop is $5. They are open every day of the year and don't spend nearly as much money improving the theater as CP spends on improvements every year.

And people on here cry about $3 for a pop.

You are at a park that is only open roughly 6 months out of the year and has to earn all of their income during that time.

Yea, but at a theater(at least the one I go to), has free refills on soda and popcorn.

Kennywood and busch gardens are open 6 months out of the year, and there prices are fair, and the food quality is great. So that argument does not fly. Last time I checked, they are a buisness and are here to make money as well. Kennywood and busch are both making large park improvements this year, so the lower food prices don't seem to be hurting them.

If I go to a retsaurant, I am there for a meal. So you are making money off of me regardless if I am drinking soda or water. A soda at a restaurant may cost $1-$2 with free refills. Cedarpoint has just made $10 a car, $45 per person before people even get hungry. So I am positive that free cups of water is not gonna put them in the red. And by shrinking the cups, THEY are making the lines longer as people are going to be asking for more than 1 cup or they are going to be making more trips to the stand.

Zoug68.....

What planet are you on? Where else have you seen $13 footlongs, $7 hot dogs, $4 sodas, a $25 pizza, $9 slurpies. They even advertise the $7 hot dog as being a great deal. Tell me thats not a slap in the face.

" If you can't afford to pay the prices for items in the park, that are still lower than many other venues, go use the drinking fountains."???

What other venues? Even a Detroit tiger game has cheaper prices than cedarpoint.

If they need every penny in this economy, they are going about it the wrong way.

Just to play devil's advocate here, when I went to a Tiger's game on their opening day, a $5 Little Ceasar's "Hot and Ready" pizza was $14...

What they really need in the park are some sort of devices that dispense water for free, without the need for cups. Now THAT would be awesome.

Crazy Horse, I've never seen a $7.00 hot dog. Are you talking about the carts that sell brats and hot dogs? That includes chips and a drink and it is actually a pretty good deal.

Zoug68, I have a problem with the inference that those of us who go to concession stands for free water do not support the park. Speaking for myself I drop a nice amount of cash at Cedar Point, even with trying to keep my spending down. We are just taking advantage of something the park offers. Thus, we are smart consumers. If the park offers free water we have every right to be in those lines. It's not like we are asking for something special. Crazy Horse is correct that by reducing the size of the cups we either return to the stands more often of request more cups.

And your comment about the $6.50 popcorn and $5 pop is weak too. Overpriced is overpriced pure and simple. There is a point were it's gouging, such as the Subway prices at CP. It's up to the consumer to decide if he wants to be gouged or not. Just because someone else (the movies) charges a crazy high price doesn't mean it right, nor should that be the standard be which we should be grateful CP doesn't use. Mcdonald's only charges $1.49 for that size pop, why not use that as the standard. They seem to be going OK.

Gristmill by SRF has the $7 hot dog. I think it's called a Megadog or something. I don't think it includes chips.

I believe that the skyride north building also has them. There are signes all over the building like they are offering you a great deal...lol.

"Just to play devil's advocate here, when I went to a Tiger's game on their opening day, a $5 Little Ceasar's "Hot and Ready" pizza was $14"

That's still $11 cheaper than a pizza at cedarpoint. They also offer a $5 pizza at a tigers game, it's just not as big as a full size pizza but plenty of pizza for the price.

I just saw a commercial for the lions trying to sell tickets for this football season.They are offering an " unlimited food" ticket this year.

http://www.detroitlions.com/section_display.cfm?section_id=34&top=1&level=3

Not that I would buy lions season tickets(because the lions suck).