Besides Valravn(?) What Else for 2016?

I'm looking forward to Valravn for 2016. Especially since when I go with my friends on Spring break, they never want to go to Disney or even Universal. One year, my friends only went to Universal for the Putt putt course and the Margarita vile. The reason I'm bringing this up is because If I brought up lets go to Busch Gardens down there that has a Dive coaster, they wouldn't do it. And not just the Dive coaster, the other roller coasters they have there as well. So riding Valravn will be a whole new experience for me.

TwistedWicker77 said:

I still don't understand the whole flying gimmick. In my opinion, it's not comfortable, and there is nothing special about them.

Manta at Seaworld, Orlando is pretty amazing. Flying inches above the water and through lush vegetation makes it a fantastic ride.

I wouldn't put it past Cedar Point to get a flying coaster in two years. Seems they are on a B&M multi-ride contract(?) right now. They did a 4-coaster Intamin run (MF, WT, TTD, Maverick), perhaps now have moved onto B&M (Gate Keeper, Rougarou, Valravn, ______?)

I'm also going to guess that Mine Ride has a limited time left. That huge plot of land would be great for a Flying Coaster. Imagine flying over the lagoon there. Cedar Point should be able to put two rides in the space that Mine Ride takes up. A Flying Coaster on half the land, and a family attraction on the other half (A peanuts canoe flume ride maybe? Something to connect Camp Snoopy and Frontiertown? Wishful thinking...)

Call me sentimental about CCMR. Update it? Yes. Those cars... not the most comfortable. Replace it? Please don't. It's a Cedar Point classic and a ride that can be enjoyed by many families.

noggin said:
Call me sentimental about CCMR. Update it? Yes. Those cars... not the most comfortable. Replace it? Please don't. It's a Cedar Point classic and a ride that can be enjoyed by many families.

Yeah, completely agree about renovating the cars. I'm only about 6' 200 lbs, not fat, but built, and I can only fit on CcMR when the bar is killing my thighs worse than Maverick's old restraints

JeffH said:

I'm also going to guess that Mine Ride has a limited time left. That huge plot of land would be great for a Flying Coaster. Imagine flying over the lagoon there. Cedar Point should be able to put two rides in the space that Mine Ride takes up. A Flying Coaster on half the land, and a family attraction on the other half (A peanuts canoe flume ride maybe? Something to connect Camp Snoopy and Frontiertown? Wishful thinking...)

I too think that if a flying coaster was ever to come to the Point, then the CCMR land would be the place to do it. It would be neat to fly over the water. Of course it would require the removal of yet another mid-thrill coaster. I say go ahead, but I realize that isn't the common opinion here.

Yes, Manta is a nice ride at Sea World. But what makes it as special as it is, is the theming in and around it. Now do we ONCE AGAIN have to talk about Cedar Fair's poor theming decisions and how they disappear after a couple years (max) of a ride's opening. A flyer would just be a flyer in a plot of land at Cedar Point. Almost as poor as the Superman clones at Six Flags parks.

I'm still waiting for B&M to blow me away with something new. That's what Cedar Point could benefit from IMO. Not replicate ideas from existing rides at other parks and market them as the tallest and fastest of its kind.

noggin said:

Call me sentimental about CCMR. Update it? Yes. Those cars... not the most comfortable. Replace it? Please don't. It's a Cedar Point classic and a ride that can be enjoyed by many families.

New cars would actually make it a family ride that could be enjoyed by even more families. I will never understand the blind eye that is turned away from such an easy solution to a hole in a park's lineup.

I've never had the pleasure of riding Tatsu (I hear it's great), but I have yet to ride a flying coaster from B & M or Vekoma that makes me say "please bring this to Cedar Point" like riding Griffon did.

I find it interesting that Manta's capacity is listed as 1,500 rph and Tatsu's is 1,600 rph, while Valravn's is supposed to be 1,200 rph.
Is that just huge over exaggeration on the flyers? Because it sure doesn't look great for Valravn regardless.

Maybe CP could run a decent capacity on a flyer. Also, I agree that themeing is what makes Manta so great to look at.

TwistedWicker77 said:

...do we ONCE AGAIN have to talk about Cedar Fair's poor theming decisions and how they disappear after a couple years (max) of a ride's opening.

Can't we give the Ouimet regime a chance? I don't believe Banshee has lost any of its theming for example. (And if you ask me, that's some pretty nice theming for an amusement park.)

And Cedar Point doesn't really have any theme parks. It has parks that used to be theme parks, like Kings Island. Themes are something I just don't look for at a Cedar Fair (or a Six Flags) park.

I'm still waiting for B&M to blow me away with something new. That's what Cedar Point could benefit from IMO. Not replicate ideas from existing rides at other parks and market them as the tallest and fastest of its kind.

I get where you're coming from, but you and I aren't putting $20-odd million on the line. I also get replicating other rides that are proven successes.

noggin said:
Can't we give the Ouimet regime a chance? I don't believe Banshee has lost any of its theming for example. (And if you ask me, that's some pretty nice theming for an amusement park.)

In the words of Jules Winnfield, I'm trying, Ringo. I'm trying real hard...

You're absolutely right about Banshee having excellent thematic stuff going for it. And that's why I actually held out hope that Rougarou would be spruced up in similar fashion. First of all, they flat-out stated that it would have theme beyond what we've come to expect from CP. And secondly, because the project was relatively inexpensive, I figured pumping some extra cash into theme would have been a no-brainer.

In the end, they changed some bulbs' colors and installed a speaker tied to a prox switch. That is precisely the level of "theme" I've come to expect.

And what unprecedented theming that was! ;)

noggin said:

Can't we give the Ouimet regime a chance?

It's been 3 years and 2 coasters. Still waiting. DJ nailed it in his post.

Themes are something I just don't look for at a Cedar Fair (or a Six Flags) park.

I too don't look for theming at a Cedar Fair park. But that's what I'm trying to say. Manta is a nice ride, but the theming and location is what makes it nice. If Cedar Point were to add such a coaster, what would make it stand out amongst the other flyers? Like DJ also said, the capacity is terrible, and I don't expect Cedar Fair to build an aquarium to keep me entertained while waiting in line for a subpar coaster.

I get where you're coming from, but you and I aren't putting $20-odd million on the line. I also get replicating other rides that are proven successes.

I don't recall thinking I'm paying for a flyer to come to the park. I'm just saying, I don't understand the hype over them. But there is nothing successful about them, and I'm willing to bet that Ouimet and his team understand that a low capacity ride would not benefit a large amusement park such as Cedar Point. But hey, what do I know.

Now, now Brandon. Don't forget they added fog!! ;)

In all seriousness, I think the parks' announcement of the 'theming elements' when Rougarou was revealed was a bit vague. The normal park goer doesn't really care about those details. However, us rabid fans just saw the amount of theming on Banshee which probably raised those expectations. I think that goes with these newer rides that are being announced. With programs like NoLimits us uber nerds can built some really awesome coasters with elements that 'look' feasible.

With that kind of access to other parks and programs to dream up stuff, plus seeing amazing installations at other parks, its no wonder expectations are built up.

I really don't care. Losing the head choppers on Maverick was a disappointment, but not a deal breaker for the ride. Same with Valravn, I'm more excited about the new birds eye view of that area of the park.

Rob

HeyIsntThatRob? said:

Now, now Brandon. Don't forget they added fog!! ;)

Fair enough. :-)

Don't get me wrong - I don't think added theme would have necessarily made a big difference. It's just that Ouimet-era Cedar Fair doesn't continue to get a pass this far in. As TwistedWicker points out, they've had a few years to change that perception, and they haven't done anything of note.

But it's not that big of a deal. Provided they theme where it's practically necessary (in FT, for example), I don't see a big issue with installing "plain Jane" rides elsewhere in the park.

All that said, and while on the topic of design, I still don't really understand why they painted Rougarou orange-ish and teal-ish (teal is blue-ish), only to install an orange-ish and blue coaster right next door. I've seen the track & supports in person, and maybe they're just different enough to look OK, but it still seems like a strange, poorly-thought choice. Sort of like the Kinzel-era choice to paint ID in similar colors to TTD.

Where did Ouimet state that one of his goals is to theme the rides? Fun Forward and Amusement Dark have nothing to do with adding extra theme elements to coasters. Yes, Knott's did get some refurbishment of theme elements, but Knott's is a theme park, Cedar Point is not. Cedar Point has a successful formula of beach front resort mixed with huge ride structures were the ride itself makes the statement, no theming required. I wouldn't expect Ouimet to necessarily mess with that winning formula.

Pete said:

Where did Ouimet state that one of his goals is to theme the rides?

He hasn't, and no one here is claiming otherwise. We're simply pointing out that as far as themed elements goes, he's not deviated from the Kinzel regime.

If he hasn't, and no one here is pointing out otherwise, then there's no reason to expect any deviation from the previous management.

I agree with Pete. Cedar Point has a good thing going: landmark rides with minimal theming.

The biggest rides in the world, is theming enough for me.

djDaemon said:
He hasn't, and no one here is claiming otherwise. We're simply pointing out that as far as themed elements goes, he's not deviated from the Kinzel regime.

Deviated how? The ability for the planning & design team to actually do planning and design is like night and day. A slightly gothic building for Banshee would have been a bland utilitarian building in Dick times.

As much as he was a Dick, the stations all had slight design cues. Magnum and Millennium had future/space design, Dragster had race track design, Maverick had western design. Maybe not as much as Banshee, but slightly there nonetheless.