Top Thrill Dragster 2022 Status
DA20Pilot
RideMan:
Presumably the Blue Streak is still running with its original trains
I'm pretty sure those were brand new trains in 1994, at the same time they removed the manual brakes and rerouted the queue.
e x i t english
Frog Hopper King:
... before they invented steel coasters there were only wooden coasters and then after the innovation of the steel coaster, there has been a decline of wooden coasters to steel. Right?
Considering the oldest operating steel roller coaster in the world was built in 1928, I'm going to go ahead and say no. Before you jump on me about 1959 - that was the first tubular steel coaster. There were PLENTY built out of angle iron long before that happened. The tubular steel concept just revolutionized it. Loop The Loop was a steel coaster that operated between 1904 and 1908 - and there were plenty of wooden coasters built all throughout the early 1900's.
Jeff
Frog Hopper King:
...but compare that number to the full amount of roller coasters being built per year and steel easily takes the cake.
That's not what you were arguing. You said the industry was "moving away" from wood coasters. The numbers over time show it ebbs and flows, but the trend line is pretty flat, and it has been for a long time. No one disagrees that there are more steel coasters being made.
Also, Cedar Pointer knows some people who can build you a deck.
Jeff - Advocate of Great Great Tunnels™ - Co-Publisher - PointBuzz - CoasterBuzz - Blog - Music
That Crazy Dan
Hmm, let's take 1959 (Matterhorn Bobsleds, first modern steel coaster) and 1975 (first modern corkscrew, with modern loops to follow in 1976) as our benchmark years. One would presume that somewhere in that time period or just afterwards, you'd have a fairly equivalent number of wooden and steel coasters being built. You also figure the 70s are also when the Taft/Paramount parks and the Marriott Great Americas were being built, and it'd be interesting in hindsight to compare the opening day lineups of all of those parks that opened around the same time.
DaveDzRochNY
Jeff:
You may know carpenters who worked on the ride, cool, but I know the guys who designed it, and they're still quite employed, innovating and profitable.
OK, boys... let's whip 'em out and lay 'em down!
No fluffers.
JHCA.
Frog Hopper King
Jeff:
That's not what you were arguing. You said the industry was "moving away" from wood coasters. The numbers over time show it ebbs and flows, but the trend line is pretty flat, and it has been for a long time. No one disagrees that there are more steel coasters being made.
I never made that argument.
SpeedDemon
Whose ready for the new trains to be absolute garbage!!!
Frog Hopper King
e x i t english:
Considering the oldest operating steel roller coaster in the world was built in 1928, I'm going to go ahead and say no. Before you jump on me about 1959 - that was the first tubular steel coaster. There were PLENTY built out of angle iron long before that happened. The tubular steel concept just revolutionized it.
That's really interesting, i didn't know that. Most sources that I looked at wrongly stated that Matterhorn was the first steel coaster. Thanks for letting me know.
I would modify my argument to say that once steel coasters became easier to build then it seems more companies focused on building them. Just looking at this wiki page, a quick glance at the 70-80s shows a disproportionate amount of steel to wooden coasters being built.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Roller_coasters_introduced_in_1987
@speed demon. I hope not! Dragsters trains were so awesome. That's why I was hoping for Intamin to be involved. The trains/seats on Velocicoaster are amazing. Here is hoping for lap bar only!
CPVet
SpeedDemon:
Whose ready for the new trains to be absolute garbage!!!
Wouldn’t make sense for Premier to be doing the conversion if the old track was being send to Europe. But a lot of the puzzle pieces aren’t fitting into place, so who knows?
That Crazy Dan
Stupid question... was the track for CP's Intamins manufactured at the same plant in Clermont that B&M uses, or does that facility only do B&M track? Couldn't remember if the track was originally made in Europe and shipped over or not.
djDaemon
Frog Hopper King:
I never made that argument.
Wait, what? First, Cedar Pointer made this claim (which you +1'd):
Cedar Pointer:
The market has been moving away from wood coasters for years.
To which Jeff responded:
Jeff:
Again, the companies building wood coasters would be shocked to hear this.
To which you responded:
Frog Hopper King:
Then why of the 96 new coasters being built next year is only one of them a wooden coaster? Seems like the overwhelming data disproves your anecdote. right?
Which I pointed out was a poor argument given the data literally shows that wooden coasters, while rarer than steel, are basically as popular as they've been throughout modern history.
Brandon
SpeedDemon
CPVet:
Wouldn’t make sense for Premier to be doing the conversion if the old track was being send to Europe.
I mean. If Intamin is doing the track/launch conversions and premier is only handling the trains. I don’t think it would matter where the track goes. “industry legend” could very well suggest they are working with intamin not CP.
Skydiver
The terms "Industry legend" and "legacy attraction on a grander scale" could mean damn near anything about many people, companies, parks, and attractions.
SpeedDemon
Fair point. But those things combined with what we know make me suspect it’s TTD. Do we have any other huge rides being reworked in the same way that we know about (other than RMCs)?
HeyIsntThatRob?
That Crazy Dan:
Stupid question... was the track for CP's Intamins manufactured at the same plant in Clermont that B&M uses, or does that facility only do B&M track? Couldn't remember if the track was originally made in Europe and shipped over or not.
Stakotra Manufacturing in Slovakia. Here are pics from when they prefit the track and supports while the tower was laying on its side, all before it was shipped to CP!
Frog Hopper King
djDaemon:
Frog Hopper King:
I never made that argument.
Wait, what? First, Cedar Pointer made this claim (which you +1'd):
Cedar Pointer:
The market has been moving away from wood coasters for years.
To which Jeff responded:
Jeff:
Again, the companies building wood coasters would be shocked to hear this.
To which you responded:
Frog Hopper King:
Then why of the 96 new coasters being built next year is only one of them a wooden coaster? Seems like the overwhelming data disproves your anecdote. right?
Which I pointed out was a poor argument given the data literally shows that wooden coasters, while rarer than steel, are basically as popular as they've been throughout modern history.
To Quote Jeff. "You are vastly overestimating my investment in this topic."
Jeff
Says the guy who has made 40 posts in this topic, a fifth of his total "investment" in the last ten years. LULZ
Keep trollin', yo...
Jeff - Advocate of Great Great Tunnels™ - Co-Publisher - PointBuzz - CoasterBuzz - Blog - Music
Frog Hopper King
The same critique can easily be levied against you. (it's almost like I was subtly making that point with my post.)
And I am not trolling, so nice mind-reading there Jeff.
e x i t english
So.. uh, when does that "Ignore" feature get implemented? :D
Jeff
Jeff - Advocate of Great Great Tunnels™ - Co-Publisher - PointBuzz - CoasterBuzz - Blog - Music
Cedar Pointer
Jeff:
Cedar Pointer:
I know people that built Shivering Timbers and they are currently building wooden decks now.
You may know carpenters who worked on the ride, cool, but I know the guys who designed it, and they're still quite employed, innovating and profitable.
My uncle works for Nintendo
The Crystal Method is the only way to find The Winner!
Invertalon
I have a feeling the Premier deal is with Montezooma's Revenge at Knott's and not Dragster. It makes far more sense.
-Steve
Kevinj
Cedar Pointer:
My uncle works for Nintendo
Promoter of fog.
Briella
Zamperla released their new LSM train. https://twitter.com/TPArchive/status/1592590290392846337
“The Lightning vehicle also has different road wheels, made to be low maintenance and withstand high acceleration: they will soon be seen on some of the world’s fastest attractions!”
@AmusementInside
The Lightning Train from @zamperlarides
. Aluminum chassis. No steel, no welds.
Frog Hopper King
You beat me to it. That last line really makes me think that this could be for dragster. THE PLOT THICKENS!
Jeff
That train is for PNE Playland, but Antonio Zamperla seemed pretty much all-in to be a significant player among roller coaster manufacturers. They're investing pretty heavily.
I'm impressed by how few parts are involved in that car, and they seem to be living up to the design objectives mentioned in their press release.
If only we knew more!
Jeff - Advocate of Great Great Tunnels™ - Co-Publisher - PointBuzz - CoasterBuzz - Blog - Music
Briella
FWIW, those who were waiting on the Premier Rides announcement, it was just them partnering with Schwarzkopf to make a "Retro Wildcat 2.0". So we can scratch them off the list of potential TTD suitors.
Frog Hopper King
Just to clarify, I did know that these trains are for a different coaster.
It is interesting how these trains look similar-ish to velocicoaters trains.
"This is when the fun begins"- Anikin Skywalker
RideMan
All aluminum car frame? So absolutely no chance of any steel parts sloughing off and flying down the midway…
Seriously, the comments read like, “Tell me you’re doing the Dragster refit without telling me you’re doing the Dragster refit.”
—Dave Althoff, Jr.
/X\ *** Respect rides. They do not respect you. ***
/XXX\ /X\ /X\_ _ /X\__ _ _____
/XXXXX\ /XXX\ /XXXX\_ /X\ /XXXXX\ /X\ /XXXXX
_/XXXXXXX\_/XXXXX\_/XXXXXXX\_/XXX\_/XXXXXXX\__/XXX\__/XXXXXX
Jeff da Beat
If what looks to be true is true, these trains look great! I know there was a bit of fear that any major changes to Dragster would also come with over the shoulder restraints similar to Kingda Ka. But these cars seem to give a great deal of freedom. Reminds me a lot of the VelociCoaster trains, but with the lap bar coming from the top.
_________________
Chase McCants
http://www.solongstargazer.com
MagnumMatt
I like it! I hope its true, because I hate those Intamin seat belts on MF and TD, they are a pain!
djDaemon
RideMan:
All aluminum car frame? So absolutely no chance of any steel parts sloughing off and flying down the midway…
Except for those that would need to be mounted to it to facilitate an LSM launch and magnetic braking system.
Brandon
Jeff
I think it's an important distinction to make that these Zamperla restraints, or really even those on Maverick, are not OTSR's, they're lap bars that happen to come from overhead instead of the floor.
Jeff - Advocate of Great Great Tunnels™ - Co-Publisher - PointBuzz - CoasterBuzz - Blog - Music
Jeff da Beat
I think that's an important distinction. They may come down from the top, but the restraint works the same way a lap bar would work. Kingda Ka has OTSR, but they allow for far more movement than something like Corkscrew.
_________________
Chase McCants
http://www.solongstargazer.com
MagnumMatt
Is the belt bucked between the legs and attached to the lap bar or is there a sperate seatbelt? Hard to see in the pics.
Tennessee_CP_Fan
So the Lightning trains for PNE Playland are 12 passenger (3 cars, 4 seats per car). TTD was 18, so there is a weight reduction. The aluminum frame has to be a weight reduction as well. It has been discussed earlier that a limiting factor of an LSM launch on TTD was the weight of the trains (15 tons if I recall correctly). Very intriguing....
Nick
heric
Assuming these are the trains and no layout changes - what is everyone thinking toward 2023 or 2024?
Jeff
They can make the trains any length they want, if they can tune them well enough to launch at the target speed. Kids don't seem to remember Dragster when the back seat was occupied by projectile tires.
Jeff - Advocate of Great Great Tunnels™ - Co-Publisher - PointBuzz - CoasterBuzz - Blog - Music
MagnumMatt
I remember those tires. How long did they last? It was a weight issue correct?
Shades
Jeff:
They can make the trains any length they want, if they can tune them well enough to launch at the target speed.
On a new coaster I would agree. But for an existing coaster it won't be that simple. Pairing a train that holds 36 people with a motor that can only get an 18 person train up to speed doesn't work. Neither does a train that exceeds the power that can be generated in the available space with the LSMs.
Closed topic.