Steel Vengeance

^^That'a true, but again, I have a relative who thinks it's just another Rougarou-level revamp, which he isn't a huge fan of. If I just happen to know somebody who thinks that way, it makes me wonder how many other people do.

Well, regardless of what SV lines are like opening year, I guarantee that they will be crazy long all day in future years. It's like Maverick; once everyone realized it was amazing, the lines never stopped being ridiculous.

Me personally, I'll refer the coaster as Mean Vengeance. No disrespect to Cedar Point I just don't like the new name that was given to the coaster. As I mentioned in a previous post we all knew Mean Streak wasn't being torn down and removed from the park, and the lead green car from Mean Streak was coming out of the grave, not laying on it's side, nor was it upside down. Here's something to think about. Kings Dominion renaming Hurler Twisted Timbers. The problem with that name is that the structure isn't twisted, the track is, and it's steel. If KD had elected to go with RMC'S wooden Topper Track then Twisted Timbers name would make more since simply because of the twisted wooden track. So why not rename the coaster Twisted Hurler because if park guest thought they would hurl on the original coaster, well Twisted Hurler would really give park guest a reason to hurl. :-)

I would imagine that around 2 pm the lines in the front of the park are going to be a lot shorter than they were last year. If you don't get early entry or don't get in line at the gate early enough your going to wait a long time to ride SV. Maverick should sustain it's average wait time. I don't know about Millenium though. That's probably a day to day toss up. With the amount of top of the line coasters CP has now the park should spread the crowds around pretty well. Looking forward to going to the front of the park before dinner and being able to get lots of rides without waiting very long. I wouldn't want to be back around Maverick or SV after the general public gets back there though. It all depends on who you go with though. There are still a lot of people who bring younger children or people who don't want high thrills. With those groups SV might not be that big of a draw. I'd say the line for SV will be 3 hours most of the season once May is over. That is once the park has been open for an hour. I would expect that the ride will still be running 2.5 hours after the park closes most nights. I can't wait to be sitting outside the camper listening to people screaming on the ride that late at night.

Ellex K. said:
Me personally, I'll refer the coaster as Mean Vengeance. No disrespect to Cedar Point I just don't like the new name that was given to the coaster. As I mentioned in a previous post we all knew Mean Streak wasn't being torn down and removed from the park, and the lead green car from Mean Streak was coming out of the grave, not laying on it's side, nor was it upside down. Here's something to think about. Kings Dominion renaming Hurler Twisted Timbers. The problem with that name is that the structure isn't twisted, the track is, and it's steel. If KD had elected to go with RMC'S wooden Topper Track then Twisted Timbers name would make more since simply because of the twisted wooden track. So why not rename the coaster Twisted Hurler because if park guest thought they would hurl on the original coaster, well Twisted Hurler would really give park guest a reason to hurl. :-)

Why does everything have to be so literal? (:

What an incredible time at Cedar Point we get to see. I'm one of the "older guard" that grew up as a kid and teen with Magnum, Mean Streak, and Raptor exploding on the scene. Back then you simply knew that the new ride would have an insane line, more or less all day. And by insane I mean upwards up 3 hours or so.

Now, I say this with the disclosure that we don't visit the park on peak days, so it's been awhile since I have seen the park on a Saturday in July, but from recent experience it seems the only line in the park that routinely slips into the "no thanks" category for us has been Maverick. I would argue that this is a combination of two things; 1) it's just frickin' awesome, and 2) there has been nothing else do do (coaster-wise) on a major scale for decades (sorry, Henry). That is, once you were back there, it was Maverick time.

The park, and I would assume this is intentional, has done a great job of spreading out the "big boys" throughout the landscape. With Valravn's addition, we noticed a pretty significant impact on the lines of Millennium and Dragster (of course, this is all first-hand anecdotal). I'm curious to see what impact SV has on Maverick's line, as there will finally be something else to do at the tip of the peninsula.

For those of you that did visit on busier days, did Valravn get those 3-4 hour lines that were so typical back in the 1990's? My assumption has been that those are rarer experiences, only because the park has exponentially more big coasters today than it did when I was growing up.

I'm curious to see how the loading & restraint checking goes on SV. When Goliath opened at SFGAm, they had four people checking restraints. When you sat down, they instructed you only to buckle your seat belt, and not to pull down on the restraint. Then the first set of two would go from the front of the train all the way to the back, only checking belts. After your belt was checked, the second group of checkers would go down, pushing down everyone's restraint for them, and checking them once they were down. Once this was complete, they would do their "all clears," and dispatch the train. This made for really slow operations for the first year of operation. Since then, they've reduced to a single restraint/belt check, but it's still not a dramatically fast operation. That ride only has 2 trains, and it stacks every time.

With that said, Cedar Point runs rides significantly more efficiently than SFGAm. So I definitely don't expect an operation this slow, especially considering SV will have 3 trains. But I still think it will be interesting to see how it's handled in the first months of SV operation, and how quickly they can move trains.

To be fair, Skyhawk ride ops instruct guests to not push down on the bar as well. I think RMC was also working out an issue with their trains around the time Goliath opened, resulting in extra safety measures.

Kevinj said:

I would argue that this is a combination of two things; 1) it's just frickin' awesome, and 2) there has been nothing else do do (coaster-wise) on a major scale for decades (sorry, Henry). That is, once you were back there, it was Maverick time.

I agree with this statement. I also think that once you got to the back of the park, if you said "no" to other longer lines, you gave up once you got to Maverick and just got in line. I also think the capacity struggles a little bit on Maverick.

audi0c0aster1 said:
To be fair, Skyhawk ride ops instruct guests to not push down on the bar as well. I think RMC was also working out an issue with their trains around the time Goliath opened, resulting in extra safety measures.

They still do the seat belts then lap bars on the RMCs. At least they have on every one I’ve been on. Hoping it changes because while it doesn’t slow capacity too much it’s annoying for them to have to keep repeating it every 15 seconds and even then people still neglect to listen.

I was going to add capacity, but my post was already too long.

I can remember 1994 vividly. The DJs in line, the invert experience the new thing; Raptor's line was always jam-packed. And yet, it never "felt" that bad because, thanks to the capacity and reliability, the line was seemingly always moving. This is in comparison to, say, Maverick, where there are often long periods of time when you just stand there. Waiting. And waiting. Wondering if you will make it to the station before it breaks down.

I have zero RMC experience, but as others have noted, I think the line will have a lot to do with the operations. In that regard, I would throw the benefit of the doubt at Cedar Point, which still does an incredible job relative to other North American parks.

I would imagine this would make Maverick's lines longer than in years past due to the proximity to the new attraction. Maverick and SV will likely be ride it early or skip it rides this year. Although that's always been the case with Maverick, just probably more so this year.

Six Flags' double check procedure was a reaction to the NTAG accident, which was a similar ride (albeit with different trains.) Do keep in mind Goliath opened only a year later, so the extra "safety" procedures were still going on.

I do recall on TTD, they used to tell people not to pull down their lapbars until belts were checked. I believe they also did this on Xcelerator last time I was at KBF (this past summer.)

Every Six Flags RMC I've encountered still uses the "don't pull your own bar" system IIRC, except Wicked Cyclone (which lets you pull down your own bar, though I think they may have still had you keep your bar up until the belt was checked, and if so, they certainly came back to check the bar after you pulled it down.) Luckily, they've done away with the ridiculous, separate checks.

In terms of marketing SV to the public, I would say it will be a draw to most people that are regulars to CP i.e. visit at least every other year. For folks that come once every 4+ years, there will be other new rides to hit first before reaching SV at the back of the park especially Valravn which you have to walk right by if you enter through any gate other than the one for Resorts. For some visitors that have driven from hours away (myself included), it can be gratifying to just ride ANY coaster that has a short line upon entering the park.

There will be a fair number of visitors that will also see the big mountain of wood and obviously deem it as a 'rough' wooden coaster but I think many more people will know the real deal. There's a lot of other top-shelf coasters now when compared to seasons from over 19 years ago that will soak up guests so the queue might not be completely full until noon or so most days.

I had the opportunity to ride Goliath at SFGAm in 2016 and they were still being very cautious on checking seatbelts and insisting on pulling down the lapbar for you. To the point where they would pop the bar open if a guest had done it for themselves. This doesn't help for efficiency purposes.

CP seems to be risk-averse with their operations (rain policy, seatbelts on rides not designed for them) and I can see them being nervous on a coaster with this much in the way of G forces. The lapbar is absolutely necessary on this ride compared to B&Ms and Mill Force where the Gs being pulled aren't enough to launch you out of your seat even if the bar fails.

Hopefully, SV will have fewer mechanical breakdowns due to being a 'simple' coaster when compared to Maverick or Valravn which add extra levels of complexity to the ride with the launches and holding brakes, respectively. The fact that there's only 24 seats per train isn't going to help matters though. Hopefully, no bins will be on the platform.

Besides the thrills that I anticipate SV will surely offer, one aspect of the ride that I am looking forward to is the view while ascending the lift hill. The view from Mean Streak was breathtaking with the lake right there & Marblehead & Kelly's Island off in the distance, as well as the CP park on the right. With the added height it should be sweet. I enjoy taking in the views from the heights & angles of the various coasters. Heck, even Blue Streak has a good view of the Marina & Sandusky. My son always points out Famous Daves & the windmill across the bay.

That reminds me, when I first came to CP in the 70's, Blue Streak was the biggest, baddest coaster around. Boy, have things changed. Don't get me wrong, it is still a great coaster.

CP may be risk-averse, but they probably will run this ride relatively efficiently. They tend to operate quite well.

MF is probably more than capable of ejecting a totally unrestrained rider on the first drop, at least. And unlike an RMC, its restraints don't have sensors. Ditto for TTD.

My only RMC experience is Lightning Rod and the operations were VERY slow. Yes, that's Dollywood and this is CP and Lightning Rod might be different than other RMC's, but there were certain things about the ride that limit the speed somewhat too. I wasn't impressed with the way the trains moved, parked, lapbars released, etc. The one train had to be clear of the station before the next one could start coming in, there was an obnoxious 5 second delay between the train stopping and the lapbars releasing, and the train would stop oddly behind the station even when they were only running one train. The lapboars need to be pushed up with some force and don't pop up on their own with a small push like Millennium Force or Dragster. Little things like that really add up over the course of a day. Hoping RMC and IOE can clean some of this up for Steel Vengeance. I'm not sure how much of it actually their doing in programming vs physical limitations of the trains vs what the park has asked for, etc.

Hey, how restrictive are the RMC trains? I would like to know that, because I'm wondering if I'd be able to fit in one.

It seems to differ for everyone because people who are taller, shorter, skinnier, and of larger size than me have all said they are not restrictive or uncomfortable. However IMO they are quite uncomfortable and restrictive. However this is mostly due to the shin bars which jam into your legs and force you to bend your legs at an awkward angle. I’m 6’2” 180lbs for reference. Although weight isn’t as important as body shape when discussing restraints.

This ride also has completely different trains, so all of this info might have to be thrown out of the window. Hopefully people don't dislike the new trains in comparison to the old ones (ie. Valravn)