Ridiculous Changes

I think the type of stuff that bholcomb mentioned is a big reason why you're seeing a decline in employee morale. Things like getting written up for a high five (even before or after the ride) and changing policies and operating procedures that make the job harder, even undoing things that people have been trained to do previously. All this while people are still getting paid the same thing as they were six seasons ago. You can say they've never had trouble hiring enough help, but I think they're starting to now. Good help especially. It's evident throughout the park. Someone told me Kalahari pays $9 to start. I wonder how much of their staff is made up of former CP employees? As of last year I can tall you that people still showed up enthusiastic about being there to work at CP. It was only after dealing with the constant stream of BS for a month or two that they became miserable, lazy, etc. Sure you might get the occasional thug or lazy worker, but there's a bigger problem at work causing the widespread indifference among the staff.

Housing has been crappy for a long time and maybe that's part of it, but I really think it's more about the work environment. It used to be fun to work at CP. You used to be trained to be safe AND efficient. Now you are trained to not screw up or you'll be written up basically. Leadership on rides and even supervisors are just glorified babysitters (making less money than a babysitter) at this point. They are scared into not being able to make any decision on their own without calling someone in management first. Even some of the lower level managers are scared to make a decision on their own. Why even have leadership and supervision if they are just drones too?

halltd said:

It's a shame that Cedar Point is getting so large that they are turning "corporate" like all the other theme parks.

I guess the park/company is probably raking in more money these days than they ever have, but it's due to hotels and higher prices. CP's highest attendence years were in the early 90's - well before MF or Dragster. Attendence in recent years has been pretty flat and down about 2-300,000 from their best year. Having said that, the park is feeling more crowded these days operations are not up to usual CP standards.

I totally agree with what Pete said about the need to impress people - especially when you're doing national marketing. Some of the people that are showing up are probably going to a lot of extra effort and expense to go to CP instead of their local Six Flags. I'm sure they won't do it a second time if they feel there is no difference between the two.

CP_1984, you mentioned something about the whole atmosphere of the park changing. It’s not off topic at all because these two issues go hand in hand. Although they may not be connected directly, the "trickle down" effect binds them. However, there was one change that did, and that was the character signs. When they took away the character signs from the rides, it definitely affected the atmosphere of the park as it was one of those things that everyone would remember since they were a little kid. Everything since then that has been removed or added, indirectly affected the park’s atmosphere. The people who notice the most are the employees since they have to work in that environment the whole summer. The removal of the personable aspects of the park does start to drag on them. Instead of being into the job 100% with spiels and such, workers are merely going through the motions which is the worst from a safety standpoint, in my opinion.

Slow crews are almost never because of the red tags running the ride. It generally stems from the ride leadership not pushing their crews. I think that the blame for the lack in efficiency in the ride crews should mostly weigh on the two blue tags of that ride. Many of the red tags have never worked there before so they will follow the direction and actions of those in leadership on that ride. With all the negative changes going on there are many good workers who just aren’t returning because the working environment has changed so drastically. MDOmnis has already discussed a few of the changes that went on at Magnum in the past 3-4 years. This type of thing is by no means limited to that ride. It just kind of caught up with Maggie since they had kept her fairly "old school" prior to the co-dispatch being installed.

This is purely speculation, but there may be another reason for it though. Although I haven't heard anything to this effect from the people I talk to who still work there, I wouldn't put it past management after the changes this year to send out a directive that states or implies "we are willing to sacrifice some speed for safety."

As for the Corkscrew getting seat belts, apparently a car came back with its restraints unlocked. I can't say for certain (since I wasn't there), but I was told that the pedal had been locked before it left. Now the restraint mechanism on Corkscrew is purely mechanical right? So if this phenomenon were to happen isn't it the fault of maintenance for not properly maintaining the ride? Has this type of incident ever been reported on any of the other many Arrow loopers around the world? I find it funny how they added an unnecessary safety feature to the ride with the shortest interval.---An aside to management, don’t point fingers at anyone on the Corkscrew crew. I didn’t ask any of them about what happened with the ride.

*** Edited 6/15/2005 2:05:13 PM UTC by CP_bound***

Okay, I don't post often but I guess that it is time for me to weigh in on this topic. I haven't been to Cedar Point since the year that MF debuted. Every year I think that I need to get back, but when I read threads like this I get depressed and wonder how many rides I would be able to go on with the new "safety" features. Then I decide not to make a point of making the trip. Yes, time is a factor and finding the opportunity and group to go with makes a difference, but still.

Unfortunately, the things that are being talked about on this site with worker morale and standard operating procedure seem to be the way that things are going all over the country and in many lines of work. I just finished my ninth year of teaching and it seems like every year students are expected to learn more. However, there is less money to work with, there are more things to worry about to avoid law suits, there are less teachers and other staff workers per student, and the list goes on and on. It seems like workers all over the United States are being expected, more and more, to do more with less and get compensated less for it.

There are probably many reasons for these changes in society. Many of these changes seem to come out of the fact that people in charge are more interested in making alot of money than they are in making our country a better place to live.

I'm only 32 years old and I already feel like an old retired man sitting around and saying "back in my day things were different"
I truly hope that this is just a cycle that society is going through and that things will improve soon. Hopefully, we will not have to hit rock bottom before that happens. *** Edited 6/15/2005 3:38:36 PM UTC by Natas***

Regarding the top leadership, remember that John Hildebrandt (GM) and Jack Falfas (COO) have only been in their positions for a few weeks. Both love the park and really represent the things that we've come to expect and appreciate about the park. That said, you don't win respect from your team by showing up and dictating orders. I think they, or more specifically John, will see the issues and act, when it's appropriate.

Good discussion. I'm sure it is being read.

The park just seems so more more crowded this year. It makes picture taking/beer drinking days just a little less enjoyable. Only a little. :)

Don't get me started on MF's lines, though. I won't even try to wait for that anymore if its past the first block of queues.

-Josh

There are two ways to get the results you want out of your workers--through support and encouragement or through fear of consequences. Although there will always be a mix of the two, I think all recent employees (for me as late as last year) can account for the fact that the latter is the primary strategy in general at Cedar Point, and a failing one at that. They're so worried about safety issues and what not, it's like they've forgotten what made the park popular in the first place. What makes a worker a good worker is the belief in the job they're performing and knowing that they are making a difference. Park Op. seems to think that implying how replaceable you are and what will happen if you do something wrong is the best way to get what they want out of their employees. In short, it's a major loss of morale which translates into the poor performance of employees you're seeing, and if you ask me personally, the source of decline in "personality" at the park. bholcomb's story is a good example. Also, MDOmnis' point and how even supervision is paranoid, and that they don't have the confidence in their position that they should have to make decisions. It just slowly trickles down.

Yeah, they made it very clear how easily a person or crew could 'easily be replaced.' I know by the end of my summer, I felt like I was walking on thin ice. Even when I had no write ups, I felt that way. It got worse once I got write ups.

Natas hit the nail on the head. I'm only 22 and I hear this saying over and over and I'm really starting to believe in it; "The rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer."

I am by no means an expert in stocks nor am I an expert in Cedar Fair's practices but I can make that observation from what I am seeing in the park.

It seems that corporations are more interested in the "bottom line" now more than ever. I see this with Cedar Fair with the loss protection implementations and the price gougeing techniques throughout their parks. It's to the point now where it is becoming ridiculous. Instead of allocating a larger budget to maintenance to fix Corkscrew's problem (if that is indeed the issue) they put a band-aid on the problem through the use of seatbelts. To an accountant I'm sure this is the best fix for the park, but to operations its not the best solution. Why not fix the problem in the first place and allow them to do their job efficiently?

What I'm seeing is a decline in the product that Cedar Fair is trying to sell. I understand that part of their mission is to provide a world class product "guided by the principles of safety, service, courtesy, cleanliness and integrity." Two aspects of that statement are beginning be sacrificed for the sake of one of them in my opinion.

On another note, I've followed the news of the Cedar Fair company and I don't recall seeing as large as a shakeup in management that we've been seeing in the last two years. As a potential investor in the company, that really bothers me.

~Rob

I have to agree that operations at Cedar Point are not what they once used to be. I suspect that the recent decline in attendance in the last few years is a result of lower guest satisfaction.

From what I have been reading, it seems that the employees have low morale. How can management expect the guests to have a good time if employee morale is very low? *** Edited 6/15/2005 4:52:01 PM UTC by 0g***

I actually went back for about 2 weeks this year and I had enough of that place in 2 weeks of just cleaning. I knew things have changed a lot and were going to keep changing throughout the season. So, I decided that it was better off that I left the company and be miserable. Funny story is the day I went in to process out I got wrote up for a no call no show. I just laughed and thought how dumb that write up was. I also agree the crews speed reflects how leadership pushes them. I was lucky enough to have at least one blue tag both years who kept me motivated even when times where getting worse.

Question: Who here has a say in the amount they are charged for auto insurance, homeowners insurance, medical insurance, etc?

To some degree I have a say in auto and home. I can choose a "safer" car, garage it in a safer location, put an alarm on it, etc...but the insurance company ultimately has control of how much I will save/pay.

Same for homeowners insurance. I can put hurricane shutters on the house, burglar alarm, etc but ultimately the insurance company holds the upper hand.

Why do any of you think it is any different in the amusement park business? If a company says we won't insure you unless you do this, this and this...or your rates will be through the roof unless you do a, b, and c...then Cedar Point will respond in the way you see them doing so.

As for being written up for a no call no show on the day you quit...its called documentation. That way, if you decide you want to go back next year (which has happened before...just check the employee thread) then they have some documentation as to why you left and what kind of things you did this year.

There is no "shake up" in the company. The leaders are getting old. They won't work there forever. There have been capable people like Greg Scheid waiting in the wings for years to have a chance to move up and now that some of the elders are bowing out they will have their chance to shine.

Frankly, having worked in Accommodations I don't think that is a bad thing. We often succeeded in spite of executive decisions...not as a result of them. I think that you can make an argument that the success of Cedar Point and the other parks is as much attributable to the middle managers who make the parks run on a daily basis and if they are the ones moving up we should expect good things.

I'm pretty sure everyone here who is being reasonable can agree that the quality of operations at the park has been dwindling over the past couple years. I think denying that is just being blind to the obvious.

Quite frankly, I doubt that these operational changes are "executive decisions" coming from the likes of Kinzel, Falfas and Hildebrandt. I want to think that if they knew about some of the stupid things going on, it would change. I feel like it's more of someone in the middle of the ladder (like maybe a manager of ride operations) who has gotten a promotion in the last few years wanting to make their mark. Promotion from within is great, provided the people you are promoting have a clue. If they're just looking to make their mark by changing things that have worked for decades, then it can be disastrous. We all know that the leadership at the top of the ranks (Dan Keller) for the last five years was probably weak and is still probably contributing to what we're seeing now. Dan Keller never was around talking to employees. I've heard that Hildebrandt has been up on Magnum's platform a couple times already this season checking things out and talking to crewmembers. That gives me some hope that people are noticing and that things will get back to the way they should be, but it probably won't be instantaneous.

I think there are still some people left at the park who know what things used to be like and genuinely care. Unfortunately, they probably won't speak up since they are too afraid. And as this continues, the people that know how things should be will become fewer and fewer. People need to act though. I think the situation is coming to a head now. They can either fix it or go the way of Six Flags.
*** Edited 6/16/2005 3:59:32 AM UTC by MDOmnis***

The fact is I don't really give a hoot about that. But I poured your heart into that park for two season and love it as a place to visit and hate seeing it go in the toilet. That's what is really about.
*** Edited 6/15/2005 8:01:54 PM UTC by 1/2ofthetwoheadedmonster***

Middle managers are not the folks putting seatbelts in trains, making people stand certain places on Magnum, etc.

I know many of the people in middle management at Cedar Point. THEY are the one's who sacrifice family during at least half of the year. They are the one's who are expected to do more with less. They are the one's who have to figure out what to do when the caliber of employee who used to come work for them isn't willing to do so anymore.

There may be a few exceptions but I will not tolerate anyone coming down on these dedicated people who bleed Cedar Point.

It never really seemed to me like the GM of the park or the CEO of the company (what I'd consider upper management) had their hands in operating procedures that much to me. Ride SOP manuals were "approved" by the director of Park Operations which was Bill Spehn before last year. I assume that duty would fall on Bob Wozniak now as him and Candy Frankowski split Spehn's duties now. Maybe these people would be considered upper management now, and not middle management, but I think that what Bob says goes when it comes to ride operations. Having said that, I also find it hard to believe that he came up with these ideas. He has been around for a long time and to his credit seemed to have a good understanding of ride operations. Right below him is Matt Ozoskey who is manager of ride operations and has a degree in Safety Science.

Perhaps you are right and there was some directive that came down to him from above that said, "change this and this and this," but I don't think so. I suspect half of these new "rules" never even made it into the manuals which makes things even worse because now people were trained one way and are being told to do things another way. I would bet that Magnum's manual still says to group riders while waiting for the next train to come in and says nothing about "staying in your V." Just a hunch. Now imagine how frustrating it is to train your crew according to the manual like you're supposed to and then have someone in a tie who has never worked the ride in his life come and tell you to do something differently. It would kind of get you down a bit, right?

That's the kind of stuff that is happening at the park right now and it's taking its toll on the seasonal workforce. Trust me - it's a lot different than it was even four or five years ago.

When management is so out of touch with daily operations that they recommend something such as the Magnum V-stations there is something drastically wrong with the situation. Management should discuss any proposed changes with the past year's crew (or at least the blue tags) to address questions or concerns that management might not think up on their own. Practicality should be a major issue when it comes to changing a ride's operating procedure. If it ran a certain way for more than a decade a certain way, there's probably a good reason for it.

There may be a few exceptions but I will not tolerate anyone coming down on these dedicated people who bleed Cedar Point.

And you don't think that many red and blue tags who work there dont?

It's because of these people that ride operations has excelled for so many years. These people come back year after year because they remember the feeling they had when they visited as a kid and they want to pass that down to the next generation. But now that charm we all knew and loved has been killed off.

Also, with the base wage rate being as low as it is, it's hardly even economical to keep working there because its difficult to turn much of a profit over the summer. Over the years, many employees were fine with this because they were in a fun working environment and they were willing to make that tradeoff. Unfortunately the fun aspect is dwindling so it the good employees are ceasing to come back. This means that they are no longer the ones in leadership positions, and they aren't the ones training the new wave of employees who come in each year.

When you get written up for high five-ing a kid and fired for writing on your own door with washable marker it's no wonder that employee morale is low and the good employees stop coming back.

It's not a good thing when you only recognize 3-4 people in the park operations office after having worked at the park for the two previous years.

RideMan said:
ASTM. American Society for Testing (and?) Materials. They're a standards-writing organization, but the ASTM standards are a lot more flexible than the crap that Cedar Point has been implementing this season.

Yupper, American Society for Testing and Materials. They just go by ASTM International now.

I had heard about the seatbelts going into corkscrew sometime last week. I thought oh jeez... someone is pulling my leg and I didn't want to set off anyone's crap detector so I just blew it off. Imagine my suprise when I got on the corkscrew this week and saw the new belt. Ah jeez. I have a heck of a time getting in and out of those dang seats with the shoulder bars UP let alone when they are down! It's like sitting in a fighter cockpit for pete's sake! Maybe they were concerned about smaller riders... who knows. Now THIS one, we can say if there weren't any problems in the previous 30 years...

Train ride will probably be next. We have become a society based on litigation folks. It's going to get worse before it gets better.

CPL

" fired for writing on your own door with washable marker it's no wonder that employee morale is low and the good employees stop coming back. "

Yeah! Let them deface Cedar Point property! Hell if it keeps their morale high, let them use spray paint!

I would of fired them myself. Those aren't the "good employees", if they were then there are even bigger problems at the park than I thought.

Yeah! let them use spray paint!!!111@!111

You obviously missed the part where he said [in bold type, even] WASHABLE.

I agree it wasn't a good thing to do, but writing with a washable marker on a non-porous surface is the same as writing on the sidewalk with chalk.

Being fired was a bit of a stiff penalty.

-Josh

Actually, I think it more had to do with what they wrote more than just writing on it. As I understand it, someone saw it and took offense.