Mean Streak?

Ehhh, I wouldn't get your hopes up. RMC hasn't ever really altered the height of any of their transformations. If so, it was just by a couple of feet (usually decreasing the height). I'd also be afraid that if Mean Streak was 200+ feet tall, could it still be able to do all those maneuvers that RMC likes to do?

redsfan said:
So a few of you have answered my question. None of you appreciate wooden roller coasters from what i've seen in this thread. You'd just assume tear them down and build steel coasters in their place. Instead of building other steel coasters elsewhere.

And then what for those who desire to ride the classic wooden coasters? Brand new is not classic.

Renegade, you wouldn't still have Mean Streak. Cedar Point would still have Mean Streak. There is a difference. You don't have to ride it. You can ride the many other coasters.

If anything Mean Streak is the most unique ride in the park because it is different than almost any coaster there. Why change that?

Here's the deal. Wooden roller coasters degrade over time. Especially big ones. It's a fact. Are you really riding wooden roller coasters because you love how rough they are? Personally, I find that the main draw of a woody is the structure, layout, and architecture.

So, IMO, the only reason for anyone to NOT want an RMC is pure nostalgia. I'd rather ride an awesome, smooth coaster that has the same atmosphere of a woody with an innovative spin. Classic wooden coasters are dying for a reason. They get rough. Simple as that.

Also, CP basically needs an RMC to maintain their reputation of "pushing the envelope". RMC is (in few words) the new Intamin. They're taking the coaster world by storm.

Redsfan, I love Mean Streak. I almost always ride in the back, repeatedly, while over the years various gf's bowed out after two runs. And now, as I have gotten older, the ride takes more of a toll on me. Its a rough ride, which I like, but its not what it was intended to be. It has a trim on the first lift, which sucks. It robs the ride of what pop it could have.

What CP is doing lately is fixing problems. Mantis was a problem. Beach swimming was a problem. The beat up state of Breakers was a problem, etc.

If there was a way that was financially viable to make Mean Streak a great ride and retain its status as a true wooden coaster, I am all for that. But if that isn't a reasonable option then RMC treatment is cool with me.

I would hope that if we lose MS as a true woodie, CP would replace it relatively soon with another wood coaster. But just because people think a renovation would be good for the park and the guest experience does not mean we don't appreciate a good wooden coaster.

CoasterKyle1121 said:
Ehhh, I wouldn't get your hopes up. RMC hasn't ever really altered the height of any of their transformations. If so, it was just by a couple of feet (usually decreasing the height). I'd also be afraid that if Mean Streak was 200+ feet tall, could it still be able to do all those maneuvers that RMC likes to do?

Rattled got a longer drop, NTG got steeper. I wouldn't expect it, but by making the drop steeper, they could go taller in the same area. That's also why I said it would be an issue of supporting the structure.

One thing I've maintained since the beginning, is that I anticipated a whole new midway, or area, surrounding the new ride, assuming it is indeed modified. This has been the clear pattern with the last number of ride additions, as GateKeeper, Pipe Scream, and Valravn all were accompanied by updated and snazzy new midways around them. Given the dead-end nature of the current Mean Streak entry, and the opportunity to wrap a new midway behind the train track, and connect it to the Gemini Midway, it seemed like a natural move to me. I also considered that this extensive re-do could result in the "new" MS opening in 2018, instead of next year, when I am fairly certain we'll see a Soak City expansion.

However, a new thought that just hit me a little while ago, is that this whole 2017(2018?) Project also gives them a great opportunity to create a whole new back entrance into Cedar Point, replacing the very dated, small, and out of the way entrance that is there currently. Sprucing up the entrances has also been a recent hallmark of park management, and would make a ton of sense here, since the current configuration is pretty sub-par. Under this concept of mine, the new, expanded Soak City that opens next year, would have a dedicated Cedar Point entrance which would essentially be where the underpass from Perimeter Rd. is, and that entrance near Magnum's exit, would exclusively be for Soak City, rather than the hodge-podge (Resorts, People wanting to avoid the crowds at the front, AND Soak City) it serves (poorly) currently. This would enable the expanded Soak City to stretch entirely to Perimeter Rd., taking up the former Challenge Golf, now-vacant Go Karts, and likely to be moved Ripcord footprints.

The new, larger, and more accessible "Back Entrance", would then be in the new area, where the current building sitting just off Perimeter Rd. is, and would have Ripcord sitting next to it, near Slingshot and Gemini, as well as the new MS incarnation, and room for some shops, food installations, and maybe even a place for a new flat ride at some point. It's not unreasonable to think that they could expand the parking from where it is behind Gemini, down further, increasing parking for both the back entry, and also Soak City. This would then become the entrance of choice for Lighthouse Point, Sandcastle Suites, and Camper Village guests, as well as those of us who preach parking back there, and going in the back first anyway. Considering the addition of what will likely be a marquee "new" coaster where MS is, that will draw crowds there first anyway, it makes sense to take the opportunity to get a better entry back there, and also really liven up that area, creating another fantastic-looking point of entry. (And from a park perspective, advertising this new back entrance will help draw more people back there, and balance out the park crowds better from opening.)

Looking at their pattern in recent years, this almost makes too much sense NOT to be what is going to happen, and much like how I feel about the new area around Valravn being as good or better for the park as the coaster itself, has me really excited about the possibility of a similarly fantastic new midway/entrance back there!

To those that say removing Mean Streak removes a part of nostalgia, I will say that I was talking to Mean Streak Henry yesterday, and he said he would love an RMC conversion as long as they kept the Mean Streak name in some way, as it is starting to get a little too rough.

How many of you have considered that a conversion could start at the end of this season and very well emerge in 2018 instead of 2017?

Look at the timeline for the Texas Giant. A ride of that size is a big undertaking.

edit: I see someone mentioned it above, as well. That's food for thought.

Fat Man Tarkey said:
. Classic wooden coasters are dying for a reason. They get rough. Simple as that.

That is false. If a ride has a decent layout (not Mean Streak) and is cared for properly, it does not get rough. Look at a ride like Raven at Holiday World, or heck, some of the Kennywood coasters that will reach their 100th birthday before we know it. They are cared for and still provide the same, fun ride that they always have. Mean Streak's biggest issue is its size and boring layout. Other woodies that start great, let's use the old Villain at Geauga Lake as an example, deteriorate because of lack of care. Had that ride received the necessary care and maintenance, it never would have fallen into the condition it had at the end.

CoasterKyle1121 said:

Ehhh, I wouldn't get your hopes up. RMC hasn't ever really altered the height of any of their transformations.

Storm Chaser at Kentucky Kingdom is 20 feet taller than Twisted Twins, but that's not so much a 'conversion' as a whole new ride that reuses parts of the old supports.

I was under the impression that is basically what all of the conversions are. New rides that use an existing support structure.

Texas Giant was made 10 feet taller during the renovation

e x i t english said:
How many of you have considered that a conversion could start at the end of this season and very well emerge in 2018 instead of 2017?

Look at the timeline for the Texas Giant. A ride of that size is a big undertaking.

edit: I see someone mentioned it above, as well. That's food for thought.

NTG was the first Iron Horse conversion. I would expect that it took longer for that reason. All the others have opened the season after they closed. Six Flags has opened each of them mid season but Six Flags never has new coasters open by opening day. I have confidence that Cedar Point would have it open by opening day 2017 if they are in fact going that route.

I was looking at Mean Streak's current stats, vs. some of the existing RMC coasters, and the wooden coaster records in general, and I'm thinking more and more that CP will do the first RMC "conversion", with topper track rather than Iron Horse steel, to keep MS as a wooden coaster. Because, while it's debatable that Cedar Fair likes to celebrate Anniversaries, there is no doubt they like to celebrate, and highlight "records", no matter how mundane or ridiculous they may be! ;) As such, I could seriously see this conversion being about 22 feet taller, which would give it the record for tallest wooden coaster in the US, and assuming the drop is to the ground (maybe even dig down a little, though not far because of the water table), it could claim the longest drop on a wooden coaster in the world as well! That would then likely give it the speed it needs to be the fastest wooden coaster in the world as well. I'm not sure they'd add another vertical drop coaster in the park, but if they did hit 90 degrees, it would become the steepest wooden coaster in the world as well. I suspect that they would keep this more of an airtime machine like NTAG, but if they did go with inversions, 4 would claim most inversions on a wooden coaster. And with the huge length of Mean Streak currently, there is a ton of space, and structure to support a lot of elements. It'd definitely be the longest coaster to receive the RMC conversion, assuming that's what's happening.

I'm not saying all this WILL happen, but it's really not that far out of the realm of possibility, looking at where MS sits in the statistical department now, and combining that with CP's penchant for debuting record breakers. Doing the topper track conversion may be a longer process than the Iron Horse conversion, which could be another reason for a potential debut in 2018, alongside a new entrance and midway. Just something fascinating to ponder...

I am sure Cedar Point will want to push the envelope as far as what RMC is capable of.
At the current angle of ascent and descent, I am sure it would be possible to add 10-30 feet by changing the lift angle. 40 feet would make it the tallest in the world.

redsfan said:

So a few of you have answered my question. None of you appreciate wooden roller coasters from what i've seen in this thread. You'd just assume tear them down and build steel coasters in their place. Instead of building other steel coasters elsewhere.

I appreciate a GOOD wooden coaster as much as the next enthusiast. I don't appreciate a wood coaster just for the sake of it being a wood coaster. I feel like too many enthusiasts try to have a d*** measuring contest about how they can handle rough rides. I simply don't enjoy rides that are rough and boring.

I go out of my way to ride GOOD wood! I'll drive to Kennywood or Knoebols to ride good classic coasters. My favorite ride at GL was Big Dipper and I loved Villain and the Wolf Bobs (mostly cause I worked this ride for parts of 4 seasons). But Mean Streak is just at the point where it needs to be fixed and after riding an RMC, conversion is the way to go IMO.

After that, like many I would love to see the park then add a traditional woodie by either GCI or Gravity Group. Frontier Town seems like a perfect location, maybe have it interact with a new traditional style Mack log flume and a dark ride of some sort and you have yet another new midway to spread out the crowd.

Cartwright said:

Fat Man Tarkey said:
. Classic wooden coasters are dying for a reason. They get rough. Simple as that.

That is false. If a ride has a decent layout (not Mean Streak) and is cared for properly, it does not get rough. Look at a ride like Raven at Holiday World, or heck, some of the Kennywood coasters that will reach their 100th birthday before we know it. They are cared for and still provide the same, fun ride that they always have. Mean Streak's biggest issue is its size and boring layout. Other woodies that start great, let's use the old Villain at Geauga Lake as an example, deteriorate because of lack of care. Had that ride received the necessary care and maintenance, it never would have fallen into the condition it had at the end.

You actually inadvertantly proved my point. Big wood coasters requrire extreme care and maintenance. If they don't get that, they WILL get rough. My main point was, ALL wooden coasters are subject to degradation. An RMC Mean Streak would be smooth and would maintain the atmosphere of a Woodie which is all that matters. Hell, I Know full and well that Gemini is a hybrid. But it has the atmosphere of a Woodie. We have Blue Streak, a small, classic, and easily maintabable Woodie. That's enough for me.

redsfan said:

Renegade, you wouldn't still have Mean Streak. Cedar Point would still have Mean Streak. There is a difference. You don't have to ride it. You can ride the many other coasters.

Just knowing it's out there... Ya know?

I love classic wooden coasters. Too bad Cedar Point only has one of them.

CoasterCam said:

NTG was the first Iron Horse conversion. I would expect that it took longer for that reason. All the others have opened the season after they closed. Six Flags has opened each of them mid season but Six Flags never has new coasters open by opening day. I have confidence that Cedar Point would have it open by opening day 2017 if they are in fact going that route.

This isn't just a Six Flags problem. Dollywood isn't a Six Flags park. I'm telling you, none of the other conversions were as large as TX Giant, either. There would be a good reason they would work on it all 2017 and open it in 2018

Cedar Point GCI said:

GhostRider had a good layout to work with. It used to be a top 10 woodie, now Mean Streak on the other hand...

Well, we all know how reliable polls are. Sorry for the low quality photo, it's all I could find. :-)

I love Mean Streak the way it is now and I think it has a great layout. I also admit to being partial biased due to having worked it before, but I still liked it before I ever worked on it.

I also know I am way out-numbered. Having been on only one RMC (Storm Chaser), I can say from that one experience that I would love for RMC to come in and to their thing to Mean Streak. Storm Chaser was absolutely amazing from the time it started, all the way till the end. And like Mean Streak Henry, keep the current name involved!