Cedar Point new security checkpoint

Dead Sexeh said:

This type of security would be able to catch weapons from the type of people who carry weapons with them at all times.

Most people like myself who normally carry heat have never threatened or harmed anyone. That being said, I would not want to carry inside an amusement park (interference with restraints), and carrying in a water park is a very bad idea. I am very happy Cedar Fair lets me secure my piece in the security office, it is a lot more secure there compared to a good lock box in my car.

I have bet security supervisors at parks before, if they provide pieces of metal sized to mimic the metal content of components of a sidearm, I would get them through security. Not one has taken me up on my offer to date. (I even promised them and would not cheat by entering before the checkpoint started.)

The only security I have ever seen that I would not be confident that I could get contraband through is that of a prison that I sometimes respond to while running with the local ambulance company. Even the guards have to go through security there.

Here is a great example of our freedoms being destroyed due to security:

http://fox8.com/2015/10/30/90-year-old-woman-told-to-take-off-shirt...en-pocket/

And with that I will leave you this quote from the game Counter-Strike:

Again, that's the airport. It's a completely different process.

You're not going to be told to strip at Cedar Point.

Even the effectiveness of TSA has been called into question. There is no evidence that they even stopped anything. It was just created as a knee-jerk reaction. But the second part of my post still stands. We might as well just bow down to the terrorists and tell them they won. They have destroyed our way of life by forcing us to give up our freedoms. Anyone who is supporting this crap has fallen victim to fear-mongering generated by terrorists. And please don't waste your time by saying it's private property, there were no freedoms to begin with. I will continue to let the park know my opinion on this issue, which is the most constructive way to go about it. I'm not trying to sound like a whiny entitled enthusiast throwing a fit because I didn't get my way. I just don't feel it is fair to be subjected to a search with someone getting in my personal space just because there is a .0000000000000000001% chance someone could be bringing in a weapon.

So by looking for pockets in bras of old ladies, does that mean we can fly with confidence knowing only 99.9% of all weapons will now get through?

If anyone thinks incidents have not happened, or if anyone thinks security has not changed in the last 10-15 years, they are completely delusional. Minor incidents are usually kept under wraps. Security changes, for the most part, are completely transparent. Just because one business is showing an active safety and security change at the gate does not indicate anything about the security changes made within the business, nor does it speak to the number of incidents that do not get past internal security in the first place. Cedar Point does not have holding cells just for show. People have been arrested in the park. How many times have you seen this happen? Because the real number is much higher than any guest would ever witness.

And these changes ARE in place at stadiums, at concerts, at movie theaters, at schools. Anywhere that has general assembly will have heightened security, most of the time you don't even notice it. This one time, you did.

Encountered these checkpoints on Friday the 16th. The first one the guy didn't even have the wand on. I left keys, change, and my metal RFID blocking wallet in my pockets along with my cell phone. No detection and I was allowed to pass.

Tried the same after having some Famous Dave's and at least the wand was on. I was able to pull things out and get by pretty quickly. There was never a wanding to the ground, so I could have theoretically walked in with an ankle holstered gun without a problem.

Security theater is pretty darn annoying. From sporting events to concerts to amusement parks to the TSA, I can't honestly say I feel any safer.

The TSA brought in 1000s of government union employees after our 'scare' after 9/11 to add to a lobby who wanted it in the first place (union) who all pay union dues. They can now charge extra fees on tickets for security theater, even award tickets. $5.60 per segment, which was recently raised without any vote where we have any input. This agency doesn't do anything to stop threats. The millimeter wave scanners have been proven inadequate, and were pushed through without testing - again follow the $ - by a company who lobbied to have it done. It would be pretty easy to get a weapon on the plane, some just putting it into a bag that runs through security and it scanned. Many make it through undetected.

Theft from TSA agents is also extremely high. Plenty more criminal cases related to TSA employees stealing things out there than people trying to bring stuff on the plane they weren't allowed to. It's almost a nice power trip for many of them as well - They can separate you from your belongings and try to order you around. They have ZERO authority to do anything but prevent you from getting to your gate.

I encountered this security theatre today for the fist time, and the guy didn't seem to know what he was doing. The wand was beeping regardless of where he put it (probably because of the concrete metal things) and it looked like the sensitivity was all the way up. He would say simply "do you have anything in your pockets?" Not wand you and just let you go. I'm pretty sure that's not what they're getting paid for.

With all this talk, I'm trying to find the correlation to being wanded and an emptying of ones pockets to be a breach of individual liberties. It's an inconvenience at the very most, let's not over dramatize things.

If man A gets past the security checkpoint and tries something in the park and gets detained, do we celebrate the effectiveness of the security in the park? Or do we demonize the 3rd party security for not finding the issue?

If man A gets into the park (when there is no security checkpoint) and tries something but is still detained, do we demonize the park for not having a security checkpoint?

What if man A decides to try something outside of the park entrance?

It's an endless circle of "what if" that we're dealing with. So, while the checkpoints are not the best thing to have to put up with, it's a far cry to be calling it the end of ones liberties. The TSA is a far better area to vent ones disgust over pretend security.

Getting upset for taking a FEW short seconds/minutes to take stuff out of your pockets and be wanded on private property is a waste of time compared to other important issues going on in our country.

Everyone can play the "what if" game all day and never get any closer to solving anything.

I would liken it to asking a question and getting an answer that only spawns more questions. A seemingly infinite loop of nonsense would ensue eventually.

I hope this security theater of theirs was only because of the alleged (probably bogus) threat over the holidays and not because they have people on staff who are of the "we have to do something just to make it look like we are doing something" mentality.

TTD 120mph said:

With all this talk, I'm trying to find the correlation to being wanded and an emptying of ones pockets to be a breach of individual liberties. It's an inconvenience at the very most, let's not over dramatize things.

Honestly, I'm less bothered by the actual checkpoint than I am by what this type of lazy, accepting attitude represents.

Oh, it's not big deal, just let this guy wand/frisk you, and see everything you're carrying. It's for your own good!

So many of you have completely bought into the fallacy of safety, and completely abandoned logic in the process.

Do these checkpoints represent a failing of our society? Not yet. But the increasingly accepting attitude and/or ignorant justification certainly represents a dramatic shift away from reason and logic, which is a terrifying trend. As Pete (I think it was Pete) pointed out previously, The War on Terror has been absolutely lost, and those of you who justify these practices are complicit.

Yes, that was me who said that. Terrorism isn't just blowing things up or shooting things up, that is just a means to an end and not even the main event. The purpose of terrorism is to cause fear in the population and change a way of life for the masses. Security checkpoints sure drive home the fact that terrorists and/or criminals are succeeding in changing our society for the worse, even to the point of modifying our personal liberty.

djDaemon said: The War on Terror has been absolutely lost, and those of you who justify these practices are complicit.

That is quite the leap there, a security checkpoint= terrorist have won. I should have know their evil ploy from the beginning was to add security checkpoints to destinations, damn those evil bastards.

It's not the security check points, it's the constant, generalized sense of fear society has developed that leads to them becoming so common in our lives. That's where we are losing. We are allowing them to change our way of life from being a mobile society where people are assumed innocent until proven guilty and move about freely to a society where we expect to be stopped and questioned and presumed to be a potential threat every time go go somewhere and feel obligated to justify why we go someplace and what we have with us at any given time. That's where we are losing.

djDaemon said:
Honestly, I'm less bothered by the actual checkpoint than I am by what this type of lazy, accepting attitude represents.

Oh, it's not big deal, just let this guy wand/frisk you, and see everything you're carrying. It's for your own good!

So many of you have completely bought into the fallacy of safety, and completely abandoned logic in the process.

Do these checkpoints represent a failing of our society? Not yet. But the increasingly accepting attitude and/or ignorant justification certainly represents a dramatic shift away from reason and logic, which is a terrifying trend. As Pete (I think it was Pete) pointed out previously, The War on Terror has been absolutely lost, and those of you who justify these practices are complicit.

My point was more meant to contrast the difference between comparing the intrusion of the TSA at our airports (something I can't stand) with a 3rd party company that's simply pretending to be security. One is actually forcing us to surrender our personal liberties and the other is a simple nuisance. It's not that I don't care, it's just that I'd rather care MORE about the bigger fish that need frying.

So don't take my opinions as defending these checkpoints. I would never and will never assume that security checkpoints put any added safety into going to an amusement park or elsewhere (something I've stated before). But because it IS something that is seen as fruitless, I could care less about going through the steps, so long as it isn't creating a huge problem IN the park as far as operations go. Now, I've not run into these checkpoints at the park yet so I have yet to see how bad the situation is (or isn't). But as stated before, this is all happening on private property. If Cedar Point feels it's necessary, they have every right to do so. And the only thing you and I can TRULY do is voice our opinion. Or boycott........but I would call that going a bit too far. :P

If you TRULY feel that this is a problem, then send them feedback. Instead of complaining that people are not caring enough and are allowing this to get out of control, be part of what you think the solution is. And if you have, then hooray.

Alas, while I don't agree with these checkpoints deep down, I just don't truthfully care about them enough. At least not enough to put time and effort in to be some kind of activist. I'm not seeing senior citizens, children or handicapped people being forced to strip down. Or at least I haven't yet. The anger should be to focus on the places this IS happening at and hope that enough people voicing negatively about them will change things.

But hey, as long as we allow these elected officials to be voted in, who WILL vote for these things to continue, I don't see much happening for the better.

Dead Sexeh said:

That is quite the leap there, a security checkpoint= terrorist have won. I should have know their evil ploy from the beginning was to add security checkpoints to destinations, damn those evil bastards.

You completely (and intentionally, it seems) removed the critical context of my statement. Look at the sentence preceding the one you quoted (you know, the part you selectively deleted):

Do these checkpoints represent a failing of our society? Not yet. But the increasingly accepting attitude and/or ignorant justification certainly represents a dramatic shift away from reason and logic, which is a terrifying trend.

The existence of checkpoints does not equate to "terrorists have won".

Again, that so many people in this Country defend and justify their existence, despite widespread evidence of their ineffectiveness in keeping us "safe", absolutely indicates that the terrorists have won. We no longer value liberty and logic. We live in constant, irrational fear. Which was a primary goal of theirs:

He [Bush] adopted despotism and the crushing of freedoms from Arab rulers and called it the Patriot Act under the guise of combating terrorism. . . .

source

There is America, full of fear from its north to its south, from its west to its east. Thank God for that.

source

How does every feel about one of those "security theaters" stopping one of the terrorists in France from being able to walk right into the soccer stadium? I thought all those "rent-a-wand" security personnel were useless and just a show. As much as you want to insist that it is nothing more than a false sense of security, they do in fact have their place as demonstrated in this account. Thousands of lives were potentially saved by what many of you are so adamant is just some show that inconveniences your day and does little to nothing to actually protect anyone.

Wow..thread that was pretty quiet for awhile, but brought back to life after a terror attack. Like, I get you're trying to show a positive, but many unfortunate lives are lost, and some still fighting for their lives. Right now isn't the time for something like this.

With a couple of hundred lives lost it is a long stretch to say the security theatre had any benefit at all. What about the concert hall?