2012 Improvements, Additions, and Changes. Leaks and Announcements

The point I was trying to make wasn't about the quality issue, but more about time.......whether you are in the front row and I am in the back row at a concert or sporting event--it begins and ends at the same time for both of us, no matter who paid more. Regardless of where people sit on a plane, it takes off and arrives at the destination at the same time for everyone, no matter who paid more.

That's what I meant by "you getting better seats than me doesn't affect my experience."

The sporting event analogy doesn't apply because regardless of the price paid for the ticket, everyone gets to experience the event. With FL, the bearer has a different (better) overall experience because they can ride more rides more often. Someone sitting in the Tiger Den at CoPar doesn't have an effect on my enjoyment of the game (despite them having a better view), but someone that gets ahead of me at CP increases my wait time & could very easily result in me not having the time to ride everything I want to. Nor does the first class comparison work either; people who pay extra to board first & sit in larger seats do not affect my ability to reach my destination.

I don't give a toss about people paying extra for increased services or amenities; what I think people dislike about this is the park allowing some (many?) people to pay extra for something that could negatively affect their day at the park. If the passes are truly available only in 'limited' quantities, then there is no issue; if the definition of 'limited' is several thousand, there will be problems.

sandee said:
Regardless of where people sit on a plane, it takes off and arrives at the destination at the same time for everyone, no matter who paid more.

We-o-we-oooo said:
Nor does the first class comparison work either; people who pay extra to board first & sit in larger seats do not affect my ability to reach my destination.

That's simply not true. Well, obviously the entire plane and all the passengers land at the same time, but that's where the equality ends. First class de-planes first, meaning you, and your coach cohorts, have to wait longer. By the time coach passengers get off the plane, many first class passengers may already be in a cab.

In other words, coach passengers have a longer wait to reach their destination, as a direct result of first class passengers who are willing to pay more. This is an almost identical scenario to paid FOL access.

The sporting event analogy doesn't apply because regardless of the price paid for the ticket, everyone gets to experience the event.

Again, simply not true. Someone sitting at field level on the 50 yard line gets a far more immersive experience than does someone sitting in the upper-most row directly behind the field goal post. I mean, if the experience at each seat location were identical (as you suggest), why would anyone pay a premium price for 50 yard line seats? Clearly, there's a difference.

And while it may not seem like it, that better view at the 50 yard line does come at the expense of those in the "nose bleeds". If an NFL game were treated like amusement park ride access (pre-FOL access), everyone at the game would pay the same price, line up at the gate before the game and race for the best seats. There's obviously value to sitting closer to the action, so those seats cost more, and those who pay less are relegated to the crappier seats. This is very analogous to paid FOL access.

...I think people dislike about this is the park allowing some (many?) people to pay extra for something that could negatively affect their day at the park.

As I and others have been illustrating, this type of service is already offered elsewhere, but it's camouflaged well enough that you don't mind getting a reduced level of service due to someone else paying more. Again, in 50 years, no one will even bat an eye at paid FOL access, just as some people don't currently bat an eye when first class passengers get preferred service at coach passengers' expense.

We-o-we-oooo said:
The sporting event analogy doesn't apply because regardless of the price paid for the ticket, everyone gets to experience the event.

And regardless of Fast Lane, everyone gets to experience the rides and attractions.

Anyone else slightly wierded out by the silhouetted dancers advertising Luminosity? Or is it just me? :)

Please, for the love of God, let's wait and see how the whole process works at Cedar Point (Fast Lane).

I agree with the fact that sitting behind home plate rather than right field is a better experience. But what I do disagree with is you're not getting anymore of the purchased product. No matter where you sit, you'll get to watch 9 innings of baseball. With FOL, you could ride twice as many times and get more for your money. It's not about the general experience. It's about experiencing more. I'm ok with FOL and I'm sure I'll use it at some point. But it is not comparable to a sporting event in the least.

Sure it is, if you understand value. To you, the value in an amusement park visit comes from how many rides you can experience. For most (based on the supply/demand/pricing of tickets), the value in a sporting event comes largely from proximity to the action.

In each scenario, those who pay more get more of that value.

So we have established that a Fast lane pass is not necessarily analogous to better seats at a baseball game. But I agree with DJ; it's not about going to the game, it's about where you sit; the same is true with concerts, and yes, the people with better tickets ARE impeding on my enjoyment because if they were not there I could move up to a better seat and enjoy it differently.

But why does this perk have to be have to be somehow metaphorically related to a baseball game, or a concert, or anything else in the entertainment industry? It's different. It's a pass that allows you to enjoy the park in a different way than people without it, and yes, it is possible that these pass-holders may indeed make those without them wait a little longer in lines.

Regardless of where people sit on a plane, it takes off and arrives at the destination at the same time for everyone, no matter who paid more.

I'm guessing you have never sat in first class? There's a big difference in your experience.

All of this discussion on the unfairness of FL is way overblown. People, the world is full of haves and have not's, winners and losers, the rich and the poor. I don't see the problem with FL, it might make the wait without Fast Lane 10 or 15 minutes longer on a busy day. So what, is that really so offensive?

People are too thin skinned, I even got a dirty look at McDonald's by people in the longer line when I got in the shorter line. Maybe next time I should think for them and invite them over into the short line, just so they are not offended by their own stupidity. I think Fast Lane is a nice perk at a reasonable price. You will see Fast Lane riders zoom right past you while in the slow line, so what, they paid for that privilege and so can you.

Since I have a pass I won't wait in a line if it's 3 hours or even 2 because I can come back a less busy day and ride it then. But if someone is from out of state or it's their only time coming to the park all year and they want to ride all the rides then more power to them to spend the $50 bucks. Remember, no one is making you pay extra just like no one is making you stand in a long line.

I just don't see this making that big of an impact on any given day, despite an occasional anomaly of a pack re-riding and re-riding and re-riding...but the typical person I would see doing that would be a teenager, and I don't see teenagers as being the main purchasers of this perk. Like Pete said, overblown...especially since no human has ever observed what the FL experience will "do" to a park-goers day at Cedar Point.

There is so much more to do and ride at Cedar Point in terms of major coasters...Raptor, Mantis, Magnum, Millennium, Twister, and Dragster....I think it will spread itself out, versus a park like Kings Island, which has a lineup that pales in comparison.

I have to say Kevinj is right. I'm not so sure about those silouhetted dancers :) And to the Fast Lane part, I don't think it will affect the lines by that much, maybe 5 to 10 minutes, does anyone know the number of FL passes they sell per day? Does it change for weekends?

Sause said:
But if someone is from out of state or it's their only time coming to the park all year and they want to ride all the rides then more power to them to spend the $50 bucks..

Agreed! I'm from Kansas and only get to come up to Cedar Point once every 2 or 3 years. I'm paying the extra money to get the FL pass because I want to get every bit of ride time that I can. It's well worth the money and the potential dirty looks I may get.

I was at the Erie County Chamber of Commerce's "Breakfast of Champions" this morning where Mr. Ouimet was the honoree/speaker, and he said at King's Island last year, "They had one, yes only one complaint." about FL.

He also spoke at least three times about removing DT jokingly, but at the same time seriously. There was also mention of opening up the view of the beach and that CP with get $25 million in cap ex next year.

All in all, I was very impressed with his presentation, and I am looking forward to the upcoming season and beyond under his leadership.

What a great way to kick off our 2013 page. :)

I guess those pain markings around Disaster Transport were note worthy after all.

I think it's time to start a 2013 thread.

Before 2012 season even starts!? Haha awesome

Kevinj said:
Anyone else slightly wierded out by the silhouetted dancers advertising Luminosity? Or is it just me? :)

Not just you :)

I'm weirded out by the silhouettes of the audience members, waving their hands in the air... Don't get me wrong, I think Luminosity will be cool but I can't see people getting that pumped up about it. But who knows, anything's possible.

Looks like we'll be seeing some of the stage trussing going vertical soonish. It's starting to collect in front of Coasters. http://i.imgur.com/k5KxP.jpg

I wish they'd go ahead and take down the light that's right in front of the webcam. They got rid of the rest of them on that midway, might as well replace it with something better while they're at it.