Virus Impact on CP

I just saw on a Detroit news station that most of the south central area of the States were business as usual up until yesterday. And then I saw the comments that thee Governor of Georgia made yesterday. Colour me completely baffled. How are your stores just starting to limit the amount of people allowed inside? How are golf courses being allowed to open? Stay at home orders are needed across the board or it doesn't work. dj said it best, the virus doesn't respect borders. You can't pick and choose. Anyone who thinks exceptions can and should be made needs to get their head out of their ass and look at what's happening around the world and realize it will be happening around you very soon. Forget about politics for a minute and take a look at countries like Italy. You're complaining you can't golf, but what are you going to do when you're locked down and only allowed to leave to get groceries or get medical attention.

Maverick00 said:

Sounds like you are a Republican pissed at your Democratic Governor and need to get over yourself.

This is completely out of line and a fairly ridiculous assumption.

DJ I disagree with literally every word you said in your latest response to me. So much so, that even in these times when I have a lot of idle time, I won't waste any of it to offer a rebuttal. I simply stopped caring what you think a long, long time ago. There's no point in debating someone who is so closed-minded.

https://wdwnt.com/2020/04/breaking-walt-disney-world-and-disneyland...-closures/

Looks like Disney is offering partial refunds and suspending payment plans for passholders. I wonder if regional parks will follow suit. Before the entitlement squad jumps me, I don't think it's entitlement or selfish to want compensation for season passes that can't be used. Some may have purchased passes months ago when they were in a better financial position and their job security looked great at the time. Then suddenly that was all taken from them in the blink of an eye through no fault of their own. And I've been hearing the unemployment site is a cluster and hard to sign up due to unprecedented overload. If they bought passes for a family of 4 or more with dining plans and drink plans, they likely spent $1500+ on those. If they are on a payment plan with those that amount can be quite large and be a financial burden. And even if the park does manage to open this year, getting there may be a challenge for those who come from further away and may require an overnight stay. Adding in that cost can be a challenge. Although gas is cheap now, that's still an expense when money is tight. During these tough times, there's alot of other things that money can be used for. Today my payment came out. I just bought the base platinum pass with the intention of adding dining and drinks later so it's only around $36 for me which isn't alot and I still have income so it's not a huge deal. I'm just trying to think from the perspective of those in the situation I described. I only got my pass so I could get a Coasterstock ticket for KI this year which I'm sure I'll be refunded for since I doubt the event will happen this year. So far, Kennywood has said that 2021 passes will roll over into June 2021. I would be perfectly fine with my pass rolling over into 2021 for however long the park is closed this year or for the entire year if the park is shut down all year. I have no doubts they will do something to make it right for everyone. I know businesses also have bills to pay. These are unpleasant times for everyone regardless of your finances.

MaverickLaunch said:

The Chinese government caused this problem with their lies. That is not a racist statement, every world government knows this now. It is not the fault of the chinese PEOPLE. Hundreds of thousands of Americans are going to die because of what they did and if you think I’m racist for saying that, it says a whole lot more about your incredibly disturbing state of mind than it does mine.

I'm not sure if it's racist, but it definitely ignores the science. The virus is a contagion we can't detect without testing, has latent symptoms, no vaccine and we're still not 100% sure how to reduce its transmission. If you think that any of those problems have something to do with borders, I'd invite you to think more critically about them.

MaverickLaunch said:

DJ I disagree with literally every word you said in your latest response to me.

The cool thing about facts is that it doesn't matter whether or not you agree with them.

Regardless, I look forward to your point-by-point rebuttal of the various articles you claimed were fake news. Should be any time now, I'm sure.

XS NightClub said:

Having family that lives in the U.P.-

You could use Michigan’s governor as the definition of ignorant governance.
Lower Michigan may be the next hotbed for Covid, however upper Michigan is under same order as lower, because she can’t figure out they are separated by a Great Lake. The distance which puts them closer to Canada, Wisconsin and Minnesota than Detroit, Flint or Pontiac.

South Carolina has figured out that they have individual counties that are hotspots and quarantines them accordingly.

Governor Newsom of Cali is looking at this also.
Treating the whole state the same, regardless of density, is ignorant.

Having some parts shut down and others not shut down is like having a peeing section in a pool. It will spread county to county in South Carolina. I'm pretty sure this disease can't see the county line. It is already in the UP. And it will spread there as well. Especially if they ignore the stay at home orders. Believe me, I'd love to steal away to the UP. It's our favorite place in the world. But now is not the time. I'm not gonna pee in the pool.

MaverickLaunch said:

There's no point in debating someone who is so closed-minded.

You could honestly be looking at yourself in the mirror when you say this from reading through this thread. You're about as closed minded as anyone of us when making your statements. Often without sources.

Many people are still waiting on the rebuttal's you've promised while numerous people have provided links to sources that argue your points...

It's okay to admit when you're wrong. Something that many many people in our country need to learn to do, starting with our President.

I noticed something peculiar in another forum yesterday. Healthcare worker made the statement to the effect of: Something the media is not reporting is the dire situation healthcare workers are in even those not directly treating Covid patients, with compensations cuts and layoffs.

I was genuinely puzzled by this as I have read several articles about issue and seen stories on cable news about it. So I posted 6 links to stories about the issue from “fake news” sources such as NYT, Wapo etc. all within the last few days.

Well that set them off and responded with nonsense like that was my perspective and theirs is different. Wut? This isn’t a matter of perspective. I just proved the “media” was most definitely covering the issue. Their statement was provably false. Maybe they felt not enough attention was given to the issue or maybe their favorite sources were not covering it adequately. But the statement itself was objectively false, the earth is not flat, water is wet, the sun is hot.

I saw on the TV news last night that Mercy Health was cutting jobs, so it's being covered.

Thabto said:

https://wdwnt.com/2020/04/breaking-walt-disney-world-and-disneyland...-closures/

Looks like Disney is offering partial refunds and suspending payment plans for passholders. I wonder if regional parks will follow suit. Before the entitlement squad jumps me, I don't think it's entitlement or selfish to want compensation for season passes that can't be used. Some may have purchased passes months ago when they were in a better financial position and their job security looked great at the time. Then suddenly that was all taken from them in the blink of an eye through no fault of their own. And I've been hearing the unemployment site is a cluster and hard to sign up due to unprecedented overload. If they bought passes for a family of 4 or more with dining plans and drink plans, they likely spent $1500+ on those. If they are on a payment plan with those that amount can be quite large and be a financial burden. And even if the park does manage to open this year, getting there may be a challenge for those who come from further away and may require an overnight stay. Adding in that cost can be a challenge. Although gas is cheap now, that's still an expense when money is tight. During these tough times, there's alot of other things that money can be used for. Today my payment came out. I just bought the base platinum pass with the intention of adding dining and drinks later so it's only around $36 for me which isn't alot and I still have income so it's not a huge deal. I'm just trying to think from the perspective of those in the situation I described. I only got my pass so I could get a Coasterstock ticket for KI this year which I'm sure I'll be refunded for since I doubt the event will happen this year. So far, Kennywood has said that 2021 passes will roll over into June 2021. I would be perfectly fine with my pass rolling over into 2021 for however long the park is closed this year or for the entire year if the park is shut down all year. I have no doubts they will do something to make it right for everyone. I know businesses also have bills to pay. These are unpleasant times for everyone regardless of your finances.

I figured that CF might roll the pass. Lock down extended to 4/20 in Indiana.

I live in the Keweenaw peninsula of the UP. About as far away from the Detroit metro area as you can be and still be in the state. There are currently 23 confirmed cases in the UP with one death. The problem up here is that most people are not taking it seriously. I just drove by a sledding hill and there had to be a couple dozen kids there. People are going about there day to day business and not really caring. They think it's not going to affect them. There are 23 confirmed cases. Thst means there are probably at least 10x that number.. and probably a lot more than that. I'm glad the governor's order covered the up....its at least making SOME people take notice

Jeff said:

Nothing says that time I couldn't go to an amusement park like a commemorative T-shirt!

I was gonna make the opposite comment... If the season is seriously affected, CP could do something to poke fun. For example, WWE moved WrestleMania out of Raymond James Stadium and refunded 70,000 tickets. They will still hold the event in an empty arena (WWE Performance Center) and released commemorative T-shirts...

https://shop.wwe.com/wrestlemania-36-i-wasnt-there-authentic-t-shirt/010F2745B0.html?dwvar_010F2745B0_color=black#utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=wrestlemania+shirts&utm_campaign=Search%2B-%2BBrand%2B-%2BWWE%2BWrestleMania&mkwid=sGcjqcobE&pcrid=424878721337&pdv=m&pkw=wrestlemania+shirts&placement=&pmt=e&intent=&pgrid=97871693694&ptaid=kwd-356150059807&gclid=CjwKCAjwvZv0BRA8EiwAD9T2VdcYUj15PRUB1l3_0YZ0GtngweeNt1AyGFtNywWiOpwrYEwupXFVzBoCWCkQAvD_BwE&start=4

As for rolling passes into 2021... Not sure that works so well, either, because I will likely buy a pass in 2021. Honestly what I’d like to see is an option to pro-rate a 2021 renewal based on lost time in 2020.

Now if by some miracle the season is only delayed by a month or so, I wouldn’t even sweat it personally. I’d chalk that up no differently than crappy weather in May and early June.

It would be nice if Cedar Fair (and Six Flags and whoever else) to suspend payments, and possibly even allow families out of their payment plans for those who’ve lost jobs due to CV. They could even keep any payments already made as a credit towards future ticket or pass sales, but terminate the contract and any owed payments. Sure this would be a big revenue hit but it’s a huge gesture of goodwill which would build brand loyalty, a way to get something instead of potentially nothing when folks just quit paying, and maybe even the right thing to do.

djDaemon said:
Regardless, I look forward to your point-by-point rebuttal of the various articles you claimed were fake news. Should be any time now, I'm sure.

You'll be waiting a long time for that. It's been more than a week now of me waiting for how the NYT has lied, or how the fact checks against the president have been false.

But then again, to your point, objective fact is objective fact.

Shane Denmark said:

Jeff said:

Nothing says that time I couldn't go to an amusement park like a commemorative T-shirt!

I was gonna make the opposite comment... If the season is seriously affected, CP could do something to poke fun. For example, WWE moved WrestleMania out of Raymond James Stadium and refunded 70,000 tickets. They will still hold the event in an empty arena (WWE Performance Center) and released commemorative T-shirts...

https://shop.wwe.com/wrestlemania-36-i-wasnt-there-authentic-t-shirt/010F2745B0.html?dwvar_010F2745B0_color=black#utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=wrestlemania+shirts&utm_campaign=Search%2B-%2BBrand%2B-%2BWWE%2BWrestleMania&mkwid=sGcjqcobE&pcrid=424878721337&pdv=m&pkw=wrestlemania+shirts&placement=&pmt=e&intent=&pgrid=97871693694&ptaid=kwd-356150059807&gclid=CjwKCAjwvZv0BRA8EiwAD9T2VdcYUj15PRUB1l3_0YZ0GtngweeNt1AyGFtNywWiOpwrYEwupXFVzBoCWCkQAvD_BwE&start=4

I was gonna mention those but you beat me to it. XD

Man, this year's Mania is gonna be weird.

My guess is if the 2020 season is impacted beyond mid June they will essentially do a copy/paste of the 2020 150th celebration and do it in 2021. Even if they are able to salvage a decent chunk of the season, I still would bet the 150th bleeds into 2021 when we will be further from this and in a better place to enjoy a celebration.

That said, I’m not ready to throw in the towel on the entire 2020 season like some are. Even if they weren’t able to open until August, I feel like it’s still worth it for CP because of the enormous popularity of Halloweekends. A Memorial Day-Labor Day operation like Michigan’s Adventure or Waldameer may not be salvageable if they can’t open by 4th of July. But heck, I feel like even if Cedar Point became nothing more than a Fall attraction for 2020 they would still try to squeeze 2 or so months out of things to get some revenue and get back to some normalcy.

Disney is laying off multitudes of workers indefinitely and that’s not a play you make for a month or two. There was a rumor circulating that the parks are planning for closure that will last all summer, hence the plans implemented for season passes.

No matter who you believe or who you support politically, basic science overrides both. Even if the virus peaks sooner rather than later, it will take several weeks to return to normal and the decision to do so would have be to be made knowing beyond a shadow of a doubt that the virus would not instantly spike again when everyone gathered in large numbers again. Which is to say we are a long way from that.

I’m okay with waiting until it’s absolutely safe to go back out and back to normal. I don’t want any park to rush opening up again only to have to close again a short time later. It is what it is.

I learned today how SF is deciding to handle their memberships.

-You have the option to pause payment, reoccurring payments will start automatically if/when your park re-opens.

-If you choose to pause you get an option to continue paying but with a free upgrade to the next tier in their membership program. Upgrade ends at the end of the 2020 season (could be changed later). If you're a gold member, lowest tier, you're upgrade option is Gold Plus Lifetime, essentially keeping your Gold Plus benefits at the gold pass price. Which is nice as Gold Plus is the lowest tier with free parking at all properties.

-They are adding a "free month" onto your membership for every month your park is closed.

Thankfully I work in pharma, an essential industry that will not shut down any time soon. So I chose to just take the upgrade and see what happens. If it gets ridiculous I may pause payment in the future.

These are some options CF could consider, adding additional months onto the pass, additional days added onto the season, weekends through November. Free upgrades, more bring a friend deals, maybe even a monthly bring a friend free voucher. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if warmer climate parks try to stay open through the normal off-season, at least Fri-Saturdays. Unless 2021 attractions are already signed and payment has started I would be shocked to see any significant cap-ex spent for 2021 if closures extend past June.

But at the end of the day.. it's all still up in the air. Who knows if the 2020 season will even happen at this point. This global pandemic just has day to day life so surreal now.

Jeff said:

MaverickLaunch said:

The Chinese government caused this problem with their lies. That is not a racist statement, every world government knows this now. It is not the fault of the chinese PEOPLE. Hundreds of thousands of Americans are going to die because of what they did and if you think I’m racist for saying that, it says a whole lot more about your incredibly disturbing state of mind than it does mine.

I'm not sure if it's racist, but it definitely ignores the science. The virus is a contagion we can't detect without testing, has latent symptoms, no vaccine and we're still not 100% sure how to reduce its transmission. If you think that any of those problems have something to do with borders, I'd invite you to think more critically about them.

Plagues are stopped via barriers. There are many forms of barriers; borders (yes borders), isolation, masks, and physical separation. There are probably more that I failed to mention.

The "Black Plague" was spread by rodents/fleas. It was stopped via barriers; brick housing if you will. Rats can chew through damn near anything, but they don't like bricks/mortar. At least that's one of the theories. I tend to believe it as rodents carry the Plague (Prarie dogs carry it).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death