Top Thrill Dragster 2022 Status

djDaemon:

veritas55:

Millennium Force remains the most popular ride -- by far -- at CP...

Based on what metrics?

Common sense?

As for the rest, well, maybe an alternative marketing campaign could be: "Intamin - Not Every Fatality Was Our Fault!"

;)

I think it works.

Intamin has had a few enduring wins in terms of great rides, but the only one I can think of that has been generally reliable from the start is Velocicoaster. And even that's speculation on my part, because the testing period for that sure was long.

There's no denying though that their rides are associated with a disproportionate amount of death. There's no denying that an awful lot of their rides didn't last relative to those of other manufacturers. There's no denying that their rides initial reliability tends to be dreadful. For Cedar Fair in particular, it hasn't been a good run. I love Millennium Force as much as anyone, but it doesn't blind me to their track record.

As for the ability of other manufacturers, Vekoma never built a coaster with electronically controlled rotating cars, no one did, but Disney still chose them to build Cosmic Rewind. Steel LSM rides are hardly a technical unknown at this point.

If ridership is a metric to go by, and I struggle to come up with a better one, GateKeeper, a B&M product, is the most popular and has been basically since its debut.

djDaemon:

If ridership is a metric to go by, and I struggle to come up with a better one, GateKeeper, a B&M product, is the most popular and has been basically since its debut.

well, rider metric has a relationship to capacity: Gatekeeper (and Magnum) have larger capacity than Millennium Force, so ridership numbers are a decent (but imperfect) proxy. For instance, Steel Vengeance may in fact be the most "popular," but it could never compete in ridership numbers in a given year.

But, look, what I said was likely hyperbole: I can't prove "Millennium is -- by far -- the most popular ride at CP." What I think is safer to say is that 23 years into its cycle, it's an extremely popular ride and certainly in the conversation for the single most popular ride at the park for most coaster-riding guests.

Millennium Force has already been there 23 years? Holy smokes.

Jeff:

Intamin has had a few enduring wins in terms of great rides, but the only one I can think of that has been generally reliable from the start is Velocicoaster. And even that's speculation on my part, because the testing period for that sure was long.

Well, how about:

Hyperion?

Expedition GE Force?

All three Superman ride of steel coasters?

Goliath at Walibi?

Raging Spirits (Tokyo disneysea)

Fahrenheit (Hershey)

Kawasemi (Japan)

the tons of mega lites they have built in europe?

Cheetah Hunt?

Skyrush?

all the recent blitz coasters like Taron, Soaring with Dragon, etc?

Pantheon?

Toutatis? (I know it's still new).

Are all of those unreliable as well?

In the past 5 years alone Intamin has installed over 25 coasters across the world - how many have proven greatly unreliable? Hagrids? Name some!

There's no denying though that their rides are associated with a disproportionate amount of death. There's no denying that an awful lot of their rides didn't last relative to those of other manufacturers. There's no denying that their rides initial reliability tends to be dreadful. For Cedar Fair in particular, it hasn't been a good run. I love Millennium Force as much as anyone, but it doesn't blind me to their track record.

No, there is some "denying" their rides are associated with disproportionate amount of death. First of all, which deaths have actually been ascribed to Intamin's design failures versus park operations? Second, if you considering base rates, RMC is the murderous villain of the coaster world: they have one death on their hands, and on a proportional basis that's much greater than Intamin's base rate (because the denominator (I.e., number of rides installed) counts).

Intamin is one of the most, if not the most, polarizing manufacturers- for a reason. Their reputation of having safety and reliability issues with questionable longevity is not debatable. Calling any of these simple "blemishes" is looking through rose colored glasses.

They need more wins like Velocicoaster and eliminate injuries. It is unfortunate that the negative reputation overshadows some really good rides.

veritas55:

First of all, which deaths have actually been ascribed to Intamin's design failures versus park operations?

How many B&M's have had fatalities in the same parks as the fatal Intamin rides? I mean, if the issue is park operations, as you suggest, it stands to reason that those same parks would have fatalities on non-Intamin rides, right?

veritas55:

Well, how about

None of those started reliably, many have had accidents. And it wouldn't matter if they were perfect. Shoot The Rapids nearly drowned people, and it's gone. Wicked Twister is gone and had to be modified. Maverick and Intimidator had to be modified. Dragster has always been a disaster. Millennium Force couldn't run three trains to start and shredded wheels for the first year. Injuries on Xcelerator and Dragster. Death on Perilous Plunge. That's just Cedar Fair.

Also, Sandor is a dick.

veritas55:

No, there is some "denying" their rides are associated with disproportionate amount of death.

You can't be serious. That's a special kind of cognitive dissonance.

I find the logic that Cedar Point gambled wrong on the unproven concept of TTD so they would modify it with an unproven company that may not be up to the task.

As far as deaths, from a cursory glance, Intimin doesn't seem over-represented on this list: https://coasterpedia.net/wi..._accidents

Jeff:

None of those started reliably,

Neither has wild mouse...

Oh, please. Wild Mouse has been open to the public all of 3 days.

Also, "Intamin isn't THAT much worse at keeping riders alive compared to these other, mostly defunct companies" is... not a compelling pro-Intamin argument.

"Intamin - Our Rides are Slightly Less Likely to Kill You than a Roller Coaster Built in the Early 20th Century!"

Sandor said the most insane thing to the press that wasn't far from that. In The Hartford Courant, May 4, 2004:

"It's impossible to avoid an accident. Every accident is tragic and we should strive not to have any, but accidents do happen. The question is what is an acceptable number?" he said.

😱

It always comes down to numbers. And money.

Just like your cat. The possibility of getting killed by an amusement ride is small. But never 0.

Today I learned I overvalue the word “blemish.”

Jeff:

Sandor said the most insane thing to the press that wasn't far from that. In The Hartford Courant, May 4, 2004:

"It's impossible to avoid an accident. Every accident is tragic and we should strive not to have any, but accidents do happen. The question is what is an acceptable number?" he said.

Maybe its because I rock climb and put myself into risky and potentially dangerous environments all the time, this is a reasonable take. I think people don't realize how much risk is involved in everyday life. Its more dangerous to drive down the Highway for 30 minutes then to ride a roller coaster, Lead climb, go on a zip line. Accidents happen, the real problem in most of the rec field is negligence. Negligence happens with operators and facilitators.

Right, but you sure as hell don't say something like that in public, to the press. That he so casually did so speaks volumes about him as a person, if not the company as a whole.

Dvo:

Cheetah Hunt,... all operate the entire year in Florida, and they generate extremely high throughput.

Busch Gardens Tampa dispatch times say 'hold my beer'

When we’ve visited Dispatch times for every Busch gardens Tampa ride is abysmal.

You know what I think?

Intamin boot licking is exhausting and I can’t believe people still engage in it.