pki winterfest

Nah, this isn't the time for nickle and diming people, let's be reasonable here.

Yeah lets keep that to the summer months.

Pete said:

Since what King's Island does is compelling enough to get me to drive 240 miles, I'm sure CP can do an event that is good enough to make people drive 70 to 125 miles from Cleveland, Toledo and Detroit.

I am not so sure about that, at least as far as Metro Detroit is concerned.

There are basically 3 weekends between Thanksgiving and Christmas. There are a number of popular events offering competition, including the Detroit Zoo's immensely popular Wild Lights, numerous local events, holiday parties, and on and on. A CP event would have to penetrate the top 3 most anticipated/valued events for people, and I'm not very confident people would be that interested.

Consider the distance. People from Metro Detroit would have to commit to a ~6 hour round trip for, what, a few hours in the park, likely freezing their asses off. And that's assuming the weather cooperates. Imagine committing to an event several weeks out (as folks do for the aforementioned Wild Lights), only to have inclement weather for your chosen day. That ~6 hour round trip could easily become ~8 or even ~10, all for a few hours in the park. And it wouldn't even take a huge snowstorm for that to happen, just enough snow to make the roads even a bit dicey.

And that you - or anyone else here - are willing to attend such an event is utterly irrelevant to whether or not non-enthusiasts would do so.

The same competing activities affect parks that do offer Winterfest now. It doesn't matter if the park is next to a city, people must still choose between Winterfest and other local events. So then let's exclude Detroit. The drive to CP for most people from Cleveland or Toledo is between 45 min. to 1.5 hrs. each way. Not bad at all for 6 hrs. in the park.

Those other parks have far larger metro areas from which to draw guests, so they're a poor comparison at best.

I'm not saying this event couldn't "work" at CP, I'm just calling into question the assertion that it would be a slam-dunk, no-brainer success.

Yes, that ^

If I can spend twenty minutes walking to Zoo Lights at Lincoln Park Zoo or an hour and a half getting to a holiday display, well you'll find me at the zoo with a cup of hot apple cider in my hand.

Every year at NoCoaster, the people from Six Flags Great America are asked about a holiday event; the response is always a variation on "we're looking at that".

I think that SFGAm faces the same problem as Cedar Point: the park is an hour away from it's local metrpolitan areas, Chicago and Milwaukee.

You know what's hard? Getting people to break from pre-existing holiday traditions to give something different a go. There are only so many holiday weekends that people have together, and many families already have lots of time-tested local and regional events that they are embedded in. This is not to say a "new thing" can't be successful; that would be absurd, but the holidays offer that hidden challenge of getting folks to perhaps exchange one tradition they might do for something else. That's tough.

For example; we got invited to this pretty cool-sounding Santa experience last weekend, but you know what we ended up doing? Going to our local library to see Santa with the girls because it's what we have always done; it's just simply become a tradition. 1) See Santa at the library, then 2) go pick out a tree at Green Farms (a local market) together as a family.

I'm not sure how many of you have experienced the Toledo Zoo event, but it is massively popular, and I would bet that it is an annual trip for millions.

Even though we seem to be hearing nothing but great reviews of the event at Kings Island, I wonder about the attendance numbers; and it's probably something we won't learn anything about until a conference call down the road.

I love Cedar Point, but I'm honestly not sure if I would have any interest in driving the 2 hours to get there for this. If we lived much closer? Sure. From Louisville? Not so much. Maybe.

Kevinj said:

You know what's hard? Getting people to break from per-existing holiday traditions to give something different a go.

Look at TSO. You're not lying.

Kevinj said:

Even though we seem to be hearing nothing but great reviews of the event at Kings Island, I wonder about the attendance numbers...

Exactly. And in CP's case, those numbers need to justify the cost of substantial infrastructure improvements mentioned in the Ride Warriors thread, in addition to increased maintenance costs, staffing costs, etc.

I know of one major event in December that many people are now staying away from:

Cleveland Browns home games!

LMAO, so true! I wouldn't even go for free to sit there in the cold to watch the Clowns lose.

While we're discussing theoretical attractions for a theoretical CP Winterfest, why not have a holiday swing band performing in the ballroom? With a little spit and polish and some decorating, it'd look really nice and it'd be great to have dancing up there again.

ADA Compliance and Building Codes.

The building hasn’t been used as an assembly hall open to public in decades, updating it for 100+ person capacity would require HVAC, Restrooms, Elevators, potentially more Stairwell Exits, and wheelchair access.

Not to mention it isn't heated. Along with so many other buildings on property.

Pete said:

As far as snow emergency levels, I can't remember Sandusky ever having a level 3 in December, can anyone else remember such an event? If CP ever gets Winterfest, I think the worry will be that of at least getting some snow to make it pretty rather than worrying about a lot of snow.

Not 100% certain of the year, but at one point sometime during the last six - ten years I believe there was a level three snow emergency in a Sandusky December. We got dumped on in late December and the mall was closed/inaccessible within a few days of Christmas. I think things opened up on Christmas Eve day or the day before and it was an absolute traffic mess in town with the last minute shoppers (including me!) navigating through the stop streets surrounding the mall parking lot within huge snow mound barriers.

But your point is well taken - this level of snow in Sandusky is VERY RARE in December and is usually saved for January or February if at all. The last two winters have had almost zero snow in Sandusky. Even the event I described above happened very late in December - well beyond the likely ideal time to have a Winterfest event at CP.

My opinion is that a Winterfest at CP with many dates in December will never happen, most likely due to the weather and staffing issues others have mentioned. I am not a meteorologist but I want to comment on the snowfall potential.

When looking at a map of the Lake Erie shoreline, notice that at downtown Cleveland the shoreline changes direction to northeast. That factor and others such as temperature, wind direction\velocity, elevation of terrain, open water on the lake\lakes results in areas east of Cleveland getting snow when west of Cleveland has nothing. A "clipper", or general snowfall affects everyone across the region.

They have enough difficulty plowing area streets & parking lots, I can't imagine how they would tackle the CP lot & pedestrian areas to make it safe if there was a significant snow. Where would the crews come from? Who is going to work at the park in December? Any volunteers? Go ahead, stand in that parking booth or direct traffic for a few hours or work on Blue Streak platform. No thanks.

Like others have mentioned, there are other places for winter activities & lights. KI, Zoo's, Sawmill Creek, etc...

Others spoke of traditions. I just saw a commercial for a drive thru Christmas Light display that called it a Cleveland tradition. It is on Lorain rd. in N.Ridgeville. Typical advertising drivel, the place has only been operating for two years. How is that a tradition. I guess if you identify as something you are what you say.

I think the most valid argument here has to do with CP not being next to a large urban area. Weather isn't much of an issue when you think that Canada's Wonderland is in an area that is both colder and much snowier than Sandusky. Even Cincinnati is in the ballpark with Sandusky, with the avg. high temp being in the low 40s compared to upper 30s in Sandusky. Even the avg. snowfall between Sandusky and Cincinnati are similar, with Sandusky getting just a few inches more.

The weather is a major consideration because of the distance. It doesn't take that much snow to cause one's travel time to double, which isn't a big deal if you're driving across town to CW; you just leave 20 minutes early or whatever. How feasible is it to leave 3 hours earlier than originally planned?

Cedar Point probably has wicked wind, though. I can deal with cold. I can deal with snow. But when that wind rips right through you, that’s a deal breaker. I know walking the pier at Charlotte Beach on Lake Ontario is no fun in the winter because of the wind.

I’ve been to CP on days in May and also in October when the walk from the parking lot to the gate was windy, cold, and brutal. December? No thanks.

I don’t get the unending desire to have an event like this at CP. I’ve been to previous events at KI, and may go down there tomorrow to see how CF puts on a show. And that lot can be cold and windy too, but once you’re in the park itself seems a little more sheltered from the weather than the Lake Erie peninsula.

In the end, for me at least, I prefer park visits to be when the weather’s warm and the rides are operating. We’ve got plenty of holiday lights, displays, and activities closer to home.