PKI will own Columbus next year... and it could be worse

My family and I have been going to CP for many many years however this year it definitely has not been at the top of the list for parks to go to. We, too, have felt over the last couple of years the decline of personality at the park. Basically I think "they" could care less if we were there or not. We have also stopped going the extended weekends where we stay on point, we prefer to just drive home. The whole MF selt beat thing was just icing on the cake. By living in Ohio, we are able to travel to different parks within a days drive, CP is not the only option.

You and many others have stopped going the extended weekends to the park. With the exception of Lighthouse Point I think the resort side of the business has seen business way below expectations. They may have priced themselves out of two many family budgets.

I actually had my first bad CP staff experience last Wed. On Raptor, the front-seat line only had 4 people in it when I got to the station, but the guy working the gate had it blocked off with his pole. I asked him if we could wait for the front since the queue was no where near full, he said no, no body can wait for the front if there are any other seats without riders. He then proceeded to shuffle people waiting for seats so that there was an empty row. I asked him why he couldn't just let the people behind us take that seat and let us wait for the front, he said it is because it doesn't work like that. Later that evening it was someone else there and they worked it like usual - if there's room in the line for front they'll let you wait. So not only was he enforcing a dumb, non-standard policy, but he was rude about it too.

I did go to PKI last April and would have to agree the food was great!

--James *** Edited 8/16/2004 3:27:42 PM UTC by jdoty***

I agree that at times there is some total unfriendliness and rudeness going on within the park. However, when I'm there, I'm there to hang out with friends, sit on the beach, ride rides, then head home.
I'm not really there to make friends with the staff.

About a month ago we were getting off the Demon Drop when my boyfriend dropped his car keys down underneath the ride. The guy working the ride told us there was nothing he could do about it and asked us to leave the platform. We went to the operations building and and were given the best possible treatment. They shut the ride down and made the guy go get it. Plus we got to surpass the 2 1/2 hour line for Millenium Force that night and get right on.

Maybe the atmosphere of the park is degrading... I guess I'm just not one of the people that it really effects.

I don't think anyone is trying to make "friends" with the employees. What is being stated is that in the past, employees went out of their way to talk to you about how your day was or how you enjoyed such and such ride. When little nuances like that disappear, the public is going to take notice. Personally, I have only been going to CP since 2000 and I have had nothing but pleasant experiences, especially with employees. But, this is not to say that this is the norm, it could be quite the reverse and I just may have been lucky to catch some employees in a good mood.

Exactly... it's the little things that create a positive culture. The last time I was there, the person that scanned by pass (Soak City gate) didn't even say a word to me. I said "thank you" when she handed me my pass, but it still struck me as kind of rude and indifferent.

I guess the positive department award goes to Live E this year, as that group really can't have a bad day. Sounds like they're busting their asses to make Halloweekends the best it has ever been as well.

But Dragster, do you see that problem only at Cedar Point or do you see it at McDonald's, the grocery store, the bank, etc. The problem is that...on a whole...customer service skills are disappearing around us.

The way I know this is true is by my experiences at places where excellent customer service was once touted. Disney is a great example. Look at text books from the 80's and 90's and they all pointed at Disny as the leaders in quality "guest" service. More often than not these days I leave the park wondering what happened to that service I so fondly remember.

McDonald's was once pointed to as the leaders in friendly staff, clean restaurants, etc. Does anyone else think that today? I've used the example before where McDonald's ran a promotions where if your cashier didn't smile and say, "Have a Nice Day" you got your meal for free. They gave away so much free food in the first weeks of the program that they had to disband the whole thing. They could not get their employees to do that seemingly simple task.

I worked with kids in the service industry 10 years ago and I work with them today. There is no doubt in my mind that kids today, on a whole, have a far worse work ethic than the kids did just that short time ago.

I had an employee who I caught sleeping on the job. When I confronted her she told me that I was discriminating against her because she was black. I told her I was discriminating against her because she was stupid. But, she was shocked that I disciplined her for it. I mean shocked. Go figure.

Did you ever notice that there is someone else on the boards that you always agree with or sometimes this person takes the words right out of your mouth. For me it's Chief Wahoo, whoever he may be.

I too have noticed a decline in service or attitude in CP over the past few years, but I have noticed that in almost all service type industries.

That said food quality and service has always been poor, although I got to say that we had great service at Famous Daves and we had a party of 16. But without getting to specifics because nothing on its own was terrible, it seemed that I was more annoyed with little things this year at the park. Thought maybe because I am getting old, but my daughter who loves CP kept pointing out little things and saying "thats going in the letter". (A letter that was never written).

I think Walt is right when he said that this site has always welcomed park crititcisms when backed up with facts.

Chief Wahoo makes some excellent points. I run into stupidity, lazyness, rudeness and indifference on a daily basis. McDonalds used to hum like a finely tuned machine, with friendly and quick service. Now, if I can just get them to get my food without making a mistake, I'm happy.

Probably if I were to go back and compare the workers at CP in the 70's to today's staff, there would be some differences. But, given with what the management has to work with today, I still think that CP has a better staff than many other places I visit. One bright spot are the European workers, who overall seem to have a much better work ethic than their U.S. counterparts.

I'm not so sure about Italian Job taking a large Columbus market share from CP. It does look like a fun ride, but it is just one family ride. Families who enjoy CP will keep coming for what is at the park now, and the general resort/seaside atmosphere that makes CP such a special place. It will be a great ride for PKI though, and give them a great year.

We have to wait and see what CP has instore for the 2005 season. I doubt it will be a coaster, my feeling is that they are going to try to diversify a little more. While they did pour millions into resorts and attractions like Camp Snoopy and the ice skating show, every major marketable ride in the last decade has been a coaster, outside of Power Tower. I don't consider Camp Snoopy to be as marketable as a major ride like MF or TTD. I think CP needs to take some time off from coaster building and get a major, highly marketable, family ride. Something that appeals to the entire family's sense of adventure, but is not intimidating AND is something new and different.

Before all the coasters, CP had high profile signature rides that were major attractions, and that did attract the families. Rides like the Western Cruise, CP&LE RR, Earthquake, Jungle Larry and others were all a big deal back than. CP needs some more stuff like that, just updated to be a big deal for this decade. I think maybe this is what some people are trying to say here. *** Edited 8/16/2004 8:46:30 PM UTC by Pete***

From a competitive standpoint, you're right, Pete. CP does need more attractions like that. PKI has been doing this for years, and they've got the Golden Tickets to prove it.

But regardless of new attractions, there is still the issue of service and the general negativity. When we encountered our nightmarish service at Johnny Rocket's, I was absolutely stunned. Part of it was the anger for the jerk-off being rude to my wife (which I consider ten times worse than being a jerk to me), but even more I felt almost hurt that the place that has been so much a part of my summers for years was dealing out exactly the kind of thing I go to CP to avoid. The fact that we complained to guest services (where they were sympathetic) and never heard anything about it again just added insult to injury.

I'm not looking for special treatment, perks or compensation. I'm looking for meaningful change so I don't have to feel that way about the park. It's not any more complicated than that.

Cedar Point has awesome food. Cheese on a stick, buttered pretzels, foot long hot dogs, donuts, ice cream...... I havent been to PKI in a while so i cant say how the employees are but i can agree that the employees at CP arent quite as good as they use to be. If i could choose to go to PKI or CP if i had never been to either, i would pick CP. But PKI would be my second choice. LOL. of course!

Being a mother of a 5 year old and just being at PKI a week ago, I can say without a doubt that, I would take her back to PKI before CP. The amount of things that she can do at PKI far outweighs what she can do at CP without an extra cost added in (ie: the waterpark).

We took our daughter to CP a couple years ago and after that trip I said I would not take her back until she hit the 48" mark. I said it at that time and I'll say it again, CP needs another jr. coaster (preferably wood). At her current height (45") she was able to ride 6 coasters at PKI. If I were to take her to CP, she would only be able to ride 2. 2 at a park that boasts 16 compared to one that has 12. There are much fewer rides in general that she can't ride at PKI than CP due to height restrictions. And even if she doesn't make that 48" mark next summer, I'd take her back to PKI in a heart beat. She loved the park and the rides.

Any park employee that we had contact with at PKI during our 2 days was very positive. From the ride-ops, food servers, to guest relations, everyone was very nice and helped us with our questions effeciently with a smile and "have a nice day". And LaRosa's pizza, yum.

I'll probably catch h*ll for saying this but we actually preferred SFWoA over CP for a family day at a park. Even with dirty madways, less than enthusiastic employees and one less roller coaster for our daughter, there was just more there that would accommodate us as a family with no extra added costs added in (again waterpark). It also helped that season passes were so affordable.

I have noticed a little bit of what Jeff is talking about though for the past couple of years, but not to an alarming extent. Like someone else said, sometimes people have a bad day. We've only been to CP once this year so far and the only place that I really noticed a change was MF. The atmosphere surrounding the station of that ride was, well, blah. The ride-ops didn't seem happy to be there and the amount of time for dispatches wasn't what it used to be. I actually feel bad for the ops on MF after the changes made due to lawyers and general procedure policy. They are the ones who have to deal with the public face to face and I'm sure it's gets old real quick with people b*tching about not being able to ride. Hopefully, we won't see too much of a change on our next trip to CP in a couple weeks.

As far as the flat rides go, they could use some newer, more thrilling rides, but I wouldn't go ripping out the ones they already have. A lot of the flats that they have right now are good for the entire family. One of the rides I do think that they need to get rid of is one the the car rides. Why in world do they need 3 different car rides, especially 2 that are fairly close together, Cadillac Cars and Turnpike Cars? Keep one of those two and the Antique Cars in the back of the park and get rid of the other.

And for God's sake, get a decent dark ride. After seeing the popularity of Spiderman and the Scooby Doo rides, it not a stretch to see that people enjoy these rides as much as the biggest, baddest coaster. Scooby Doo and the Haunted Castle at PKI had a bigger line than a couple of the coasters and I'm not referring to the kiddie coasters.

If PKI continues on the family path and CP continues on the thrill path, CP is going to lose when it comes to the family market. The amount of people in the children's area at PKI last week is a good indication of this already. It was insane.

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Jeff said, among other things:

I'm not looking for special treatment, perks or compensation. I'm looking for meaningful change so I don't have to feel that way about the park. It's not any more complicated than that.

---

...And yet, it seems that while it is easy for the park to hand out special treatment, perks, or compensation, getting that meaningful change is the real difficulty. It brings to mind the old expression about doing things right: Why is there never enough time to do things right, but always enough time to do them over? It's the same situation with park operations: Why is it that the park is more willing to make up for its faults than to fix them?

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

As a past employee, I believe Cedar Point's indifference begins with their seasonal employee hiring practices. While they do have campus recruiting at college campusses, the park does very little to assure the return of good employees. Other parks, companies, camps, etc are competing for the same young (college age) labor force and are winning. Cedar Point is left with... well... just that, what is left at times. The employee housing is sub-standard, employee dining options limited. 18 hour days, 60 hour weeks are common during the busiest parts of the season.

I am not trying to say it is a horrble place to work, or that I have ever been mistreated there, however I fully understand why employees chose not to return. Unfortunately for the park, it is the 'good' outgoing employees who make a difference in a guest's day that easily find better paying positions elsewhere instead of returning to Cedar Point.

Because it's easier than change, RideMan.

BandAides are easier than surgery.

MrScott

(Spelling) *** Edited 8/16/2004 10:40:43 PM UTC by MrScott***

Okay, I have not wanted to go there, on this thread. Many here have mirrored my thoughts. But a few of the points that I wanted to bring up are as follows:

Last year at Coastermania, I stayed at the Hotel Breakers. I got to my room in the old Bel Air section, my first time actually getting to stay on point. Not my first visit to a CP resort thankfully. It cost me close to $200 for a smoking room (my friend smokes), and I was pissed as all hell that the garbage hadn't even been emptied from the guests that had stayed before us. I called customer service, and they told me that they would take care of the problem. I didn't ask that they give me anything for my inconvenince, I simply asked them to call me back and assure me that the problem had been taken care of. I got no response, period.

I didn't get my season pass at the end of last year because of personal problems, I wasn't sure that I would have the time to visit, and didn't have it by the time that the park opened this year. Then came the Millennium Force/seatbelt issue. I was humiliated, upset, and furious, that they would make it so that I couldn't ride a coaster that I had ridden safely for 4 seasons.

May passed.

and June.

I finally was fed up w/ everything, and wanted to be there, so during July I did get my pass, Joe Cool, and Parking Pass. I have been 5 times over the last 5 weeks and have had mediocre service at best. The ride ops on several rides have been less than enthusiastic. I don't hear any great live speils. I miss someone enthusiastically asking me if I enjoyed my ride on _______ coaster. I have seen a ride op let a young boy into a Mantis line that I could easily tell by height was clearly not tall enough to ride. The boy was on the platform before I was able to see another cp employee to clue them in to measure the boy. If the boy's mother hadn't asked us if we wanted to go first, the boy would have probably been allowed to ride. It seems to me that there is a lot of carelessness by ride ops all over the park. I as a parent would not try to put my under height child on a coaster, but I know from experience that my opinion is not that of all parents.

I remember another experience at a stand two weeks ago w/ my son. He is five and he wanted a souvenier cup, when I asked him if he wanted Pepsi, Mountain Dew, Sierra Mist, etc. in his cup he said no, he wanted the green stuff. That was slurpee type stuff. Well the guy at the counter said that he couldn't put that in the souvenier cup, so I told him fine, to sell me the souvenier cup and the slurpee. So then he asked me what I wanted in the souvenier cup... Realize of course that I did already pay for both cups. I told the gentleman that I didn't want anything in the souvenier cup. He then responded that he had to put something in the cup. At that time I asked him to just put water in the cup. He said No, then responded that he could only put pepsi products in the cup. I asked for just some ice. He did it finally under protest. But that was entirely too much hassle for a souvenier cup and a slurpee.

Quick plus for Cedar Point staff, all four shows that I saw this year were excellent. My favorites were in order from favorite to least were: Twistin' to the 60's, Starstruck, Snoopy Rocks on Ice, and last but by no means least, Rockin' at the Red Garter.

Yeah, the employees could be better, but this is true for most businesses and whatnot. Quality is not only going down in amusement parks, it's going down in most operations. I believe Chief Wahoo said the same thing. An example of this is fast food chains, not a great example, but one most people can relate to. How often have you been to a fast food restaurant and had your order mixed up, missing food, or just be the wrong thing altogether? Now every time I go to the place, I have to check my bag to make sure everything's there. This shouldn't have to be done, there should be a some kind of trust between the employee and the patron.

To me, Cedar Point's fine. Though I don't go as often to notice these things, but I think they're doing alright. Sure you get some instances, not being able to buy an empty souvenir cup, that are just absurd. But I think CP is doing just fine. More perkiness by the ride ops would brighten my day, though. If a ride op asked how I was doing or even smiled at me, I might think, 'She was hot and acknowledged me, I should jump back on this ride' or 'He seemed nice and we had a good conversations going, I should see what else he has to say and jump back in line.' It's like when I go to a restaurant or store, if the people there are nice and even start a conversation with me, I'd be more likely to go back.

-Eagle- *** Edited 8/17/2004 1:50:37 AM UTC by sean_s_eagle***

Part of the reason why there is a decline in employee 'friendliness' is that most are just scared of being written up. I managed to get written up for 'horseplay' - The infraction? I high-fived a kid as he was getting into a cabin on Sky Ride.

It's almost like we felt scared to do anything but what the ride manuals told us to do - Because if we did anything else, we'd get in trouble for it.

Well certainly a culture of fear is not going to help things. I can't believe that what you did, making a kid's day, was really a risk to safety or anything else. That's sad. Maybe there's another side to the story, but it's representative of what I've heard from seasonals this year.

That's pretty much it. My supervisor told me that they had to start cracking down on horseplay in the area. It's unfortunate I had to be the target, as it put me on my final (I had been previously written up for an open door operational and then I was later terminated for following orders from the person in charge of the ride. The whole crew was written up).

Someone else on the crew also got written up at the same time for saying 'Whazaaaaaa?' to a cabin while he was catching it.

Both writeups were for horseplay and appearing 'Unprofessional'. It's an amusement park for crying out loud.

The thing that really got me is that I was working the Snoopy Bounce the day before I got written up for high-fiving the kid, and I had a mother come up to me and ask me if I was an early childhood education major (ha - I hate kids really - I'm a computer networking major) because of my positive interaction with the kids. High Fiving kids really did make their day.. It'd put a smile on kids faces who were scared of the ride, and to get written up for it really flat out sucked.

What really got to me, is all this is in the name of safety. Only, when I was at Power Tower, our Team Leader called Iron Dragon one day, because a kid was standing in the car while it was stopped on the lift. He was told to never call a ride during shutdown, and yelled at by one of the Managers.

I've talked to someone who worked in 1999, and she says that the atmosphere has really changed. It's just not nearly as fun to work at Cedar Point anymore. I believe her too. The fun has been sucked right out.

*** Edited 8/17/2004 6:13:31 AM UTC by bholcomb***