XS NightClub said:
So copying direct from WHO reports is spinning...
You suggested that guidance regarding mask usage from the WHO was contradictory, when it simply has not been. I pointed out that your assertion was wrong, then you tried to spin it as "evolving opinion" instead of contradictory.
In any case the claim is wrong. The WHO has been consistent with their guidance regarding masks ("wear them!").
Good for you RCMAC, I also quit recently, January 5th, after smoking for 25 years. It sure was hard, but like you, I didn't want to up my risk of being admitted to the hospital. Not to say that was my only motivation, not even close, (not being able to do the "running of the bulls" also had a hand 😁) but it did help make the decision to not start back up again.Last edited by DRE420, Tuesday, June 16, 2020 12:07 PM
Good for you RCMAC, I also quit recently, January 5th, after smoking for 25 years. It sure was hard, but like you, I didn't want to up my risk of being admitted to the hospital. Not to say that was my only motivation, not even close, (not being able to do the "running of the bulls" also had a hand 😁) but it did help make the decision to not start back up again.
Glad to hear you guys quit smoking.
Both my wife and niece are nurses.
They both said that,based on the patients they've seen,when it comes to Covid, "vapers" have more problems then smokers.Last edited by rpbobcat, Tuesday, June 16, 2020 12:20 PM
Funny you mentioned vaping, because I couldn't quit cold turkey, not after 25 years, so I did vape for about a month, until I started experiencing shortness of breath. At that point, I threw it away. I've never felt better.
In any case the claim is wrong. The WHO has been consistent with their guidance regarding masks ("wear them!").
Pretty hard to argue against this...
"There is no specific evidence to suggest that the wearing of masks by the mass population has any potential benefit. In fact, there's some evidence to suggest the opposite in the misuse of wearing a mask properly or fitting it properly," Dr. Mike Ryan, executive director of the WHO health emergencies program...
"There also is the issue that we have a massive global shortage," Ryan said about masks and other medical supplies. "Right now the people most at risk from this virus are frontline health workers who are exposed to the virus every second of every day. The thought of them not having masks is horrific." Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove, an infectious disease epidemiologist with the WHO, also said at Monday's briefing that it is important "we prioritize the use of masks for those who need it most," which would be frontline health care workers. "In the community, we do not recommend the use of wearing masks unless you yourself are sick and as a measure to prevent onward spread from you if you are ill," Van Kerkhove said.
In other words, since a mask doesn't do anything for a healthy person, then we shouldn't wear them. Let the hospital workers have them.
At a minimum, if masks were felt to be of use at that time couldn't they have told us to make our own like what happened about 2 months ago? There was almost an entire cottage industry devoted to making masks for the general population.
Don't get me wrong, I am not against masks. I have been wearing one in public since March 20.
In other words, since a mask doesn't do anything for a healthy person...
Masks inhibit asymptomatic/presymptomatic carriers from spreading the virus. This is true of both cloth and N-95 masks. So it absolutely does help healthy people by limiting their exposure to the virus. Suggesting otherwise is flatly wrong.
The obsolete guidance of "save masks for healthcare workers" was only because there was a shortage. Further, the "improper use" comment was with regard to healthy people wearing N-95 masks as a means to prevent infection of themselves. He was saying that if you are a healthy person going to the grocery store, don't put on a N-95 mask because a) we need them for health care workers, and b) people are not widely trained in wearing them properly, which could result in exposure.
...couldn't they have told us to make our own like what happened about 2 months ago?
They didn't have sufficient data to justify such a recommendation. But lacking sufficient data to confirm a hypothesis is not the same thing as disproving a hypothesis.
The WHO has definitely screwed up with regard to clarity, but the myth that they have been inconsistent with guidance regarding masks is mostly an issue of poor reading comprehension and/or scientific illiteracy.
I am struggling to understand how you can say that they have not been inconsistent with mask wearing.
We have gone from this
There is no specific evidence to suggest that the wearing of masks by the mass population has any potential benefit.
In the community, we do not recommend the use of wearing masks unless you yourself are sick and as a measure to prevent onward spread from you if you are ill,
to masks are now the best thing ever.
How is that not inconsistent?Last edited by Shades, Tuesday, June 16, 2020 1:13 PM
^^ Well that's extremely disappointing to hear about PIB, if not super unexpected. Have you heard anything about Kelleys Island's enforcement or guidelines? We were still potentially holding out hope for a trip to one of the islands like usual again this Summer if things looked like they were working out ok, but that certainly doesn't sound like a place I'd be interested in going right now.
Haven’t heard anything about Kelly’s island, but I’m assuming the ferries are following the same policies as I experienced.
CP Top 5: 1) Steel Vengeance 2) Maverick 3) Magnum 4) Raptor 5) Millennium
I am struggling to understand...
Perhaps because you consistently remove or ignore the context in which those selectively-trimmed quotes come from? They weren't saying masks are bad, they were saying save the masks for those who need them most:
"...we have a massive global shortage," Ryan said about masks and other medical supplies. "Right now the people most at risk from this virus are frontline health workers who are exposed to the virus every second of every day. The thought of them not having masks is horrific."
"...we prioritize the use of masks for those who need it most," which would be frontline health care workers.
"We need to be clear," Van Kerkhove said last week. "The world is facing a significant shortage of PPE for our frontline workers -- including masks and gloves and gowns and face shields -- and protecting our health care workers must be the top priority for use of this PPE."
And again, this was strictly with regard to N-95 masks. The only thing they said back in late March (when these other statements were made) regarding cloth masks was basically "scientifically speaking, the jury is still out on their efficacy." That's not the same as saying "don't wear a mask".
Two stylist at a Great Clips in Missouri exposed about 140 customers to Covid-19 recently and so far just under 50 of those exposed have been tested and none have tested positive. The stylists wore masks and the business followed other social distancing measures. Wearing a mask WORKS, this instance shows that and experts say it as well.
One of the employees was asymptomatic, the other showed symptoms and continued to work...which honestly is simply irresponsible but that fact can't be changed now. Although I understand it may be uncomfortable to wear a mask outside on an inevitably hot summer day, that discomfort is temporary and you very well may be saving lives by doing so, so in my opinion it's simply selfish to "revolt" against being smart, safe and following guidelines that could literally protect the lives of others. Despite what some self-serving people keep insisting on, we are still in the middle of global pandemic and in many states, particularity those who didn't really enforce any true and enduring lock-down measures, the cases are rising sharply, ICU admissions are skyrocketing. This is a health crisis and it needs to be treated as such. If people insist on going to a theme park where they are surrounding themselves with thousands of strangers they need to follow safety measures, plain and simple.
This crisis is temporary, we will eventually have a vaccine, but in the meantime we need to listen to the experts. We had season passes and won't be going back to CP until next, and though we were disappointed we see the big picture and understand that being a good citizen who follows the rules and thinks of others, not just ourselves, is of course the right thing to do. We'll miss being at the park this summer, but we'll get over it. Think about some of the actual sacrifices people have made throughout history, not just during the pandemic, but in general...then think of people angrily refusing to wear a mask. I'm embarrassed for those people. If you simply cannot stand to follow some rules or deal with a mask then don't go, go next year....you'll get over it.
Per KI website: Smoking is no longer allowed inside the park and only in the designated area outside the main entrance. It is in the park FAQs but not featured in their “what to expect” document. (Includes vaping and e cigs)
Likely all the smoking areas are now mask free zones. I imagine this will be the same policy at CP.
Will be interesting to see if these new designated smoking areas are inside or outside the screening/security zone and how it will be implemented at CP with 4 entrances. Depending where the smoking zones are this could make the entrances rather annoying if there are huge groups smoking in them.Last edited by Cargo Shorts, Friday, June 19, 2020 7:46 AM
This seems like a great opportunity to make all their parks completely smoke free. Good for them.
Worlds of Fun has also banned smoking in the park.
Well now we know what Michigan's Adventure is getting in 2021. Relocated smoking sections.
This is awesome!! Smoking inside the park should have been banned years ago.
Cue the “but what about my rights!?” trolls in 3...2...
One unfortunate consequence of this is some will resort to smoking in the restrooms making the situation there even worse.
We need to get Brent Terhune to do a “I DONT THANK SO” rant on this. Him and Sarah Cooper have been the best comedy gold to come out of this whole mess.
Mgou58, that should be “muh rights”.Last edited by Cargo Shorts, Friday, June 19, 2020 1:20 PM
Just when we thought This thread was dead... it's back in another form. I'm not a smoker, and honestly I wish I never saw another cigarette. But if someone is a smoker and does it in a respectful manner away from others, I don't see a problem with it. With that said, if true, this policy would be more motivation for CP fans who are smokers to kick the habit.
370 MF laps
Smoking Area Drone Pilot
I'm almost 100 days without a cigarette! But if we're banning vices now, look out drinkers! Oh wait, nevermind, they can monetize that vice.Last edited by vwhoward, Friday, June 19, 2020 2:49 PM
Eat 'em up, Tigers, eat 'em up!
For the convenience of all our guests, smoking of any kind, including vapor and e-cigarettes, is only permitted in the designated smoking area near the park's main entrance. Please refer to our mobile app for the specific location. Smoking is not permitted inside Worlds of Fun. Thank you for your cooperation.
Pretty good chance this will come to CP as well, I think.
I actually do remember the days when you could buy cigarettes in a park. I think I also won a big 12-18” cigar as a prize once, as a small child. Lol.
Maybe they can start selling candy cigarettes again to help smokers get by.Last edited by Cargo Shorts, Friday, June 19, 2020 3:54 PM
From what I have seen its been working well at the Disney parks. With anything new at the park it will take some time to adjust but it will eventually be the norm and we'll forget it was every allowed to begin with like smoking on airplanes.
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