Mr. Segway?

99er said:
Does that mean that Disney World believes they are unsafe?

I would say that they believe they're safe, as they do let guests ride around on them, however restrictions at Disney are far higher in every regard due to the staggering amount of lawsuits and ignorant people that enter their parks on a daily basis.

In my personal opinion, I just think that Disney is justifyably (sp?) overprotective in every regard, as they should be.

Deeganator nailed it. Disabilities come in many shapes, forms, and varying degrees, and it's not right for anyone but that person (and their medical professionals) to decide what works best for them. It's not as simple as crippled vs. not crippled as many people have made it out to be, there's lots of gray area in between.

A few years ago I spent a summer working with a disability program. I'd say that before than I was definitely ignorant to exactly how broad of a spectrum disabilities actually cover. Many people with limited mobility have found better, more independent ways of getting around other than using a wheelchair. For someone with no knowledge of their condition telling them they should be refined to a wheelchair if they wish to get around in public is humiliating at best.

I must've missed the part where Mr. Segway is disabled. I guess it pays to read a thread thoroughly. As a husband whose wife is partly mobility-disabled and must use a wheelchair for anything more than limited excursions, that does resonate with me. And of course there are categories of disabled who can stand more easily than they can walk.

My continuing concern is with the speed factor. Any vehicle that tops out at 12 mph is a potential danger when driven by the general public in a heavy pedestrian area such as an amusement park. Now if there were some sort of governor that limits velocity to, say, 5 mph, which is the speed of a brisk walk, then I would feel safer about having that vehicle operating in the same walkways as my child.

I still don't get how one can be too disabled to walk, but not disabled enough that they can't stand on a Segway, which requires a fair amount of muscle control - and I'd guess many of the same muscle groups that make walking possible. There's nothing about that that makes sense to me.

Deeganator gave a perfect example of one such disability just a few posts ago.

Mike- I'm just going off the fact that people have said he has a handicap placard for the Segway. I don't know anything more about his situation than that, nor have I seen it for myself. So take it for what it's worth.

I read that, and I can see where in her case, it might make more sense, but she's an amputee, which seems like a more specific case. And even she said she'd rather not have Segways in the park.

RideWarrior18 said:
I would say that they believe they're safe, as they do let guests ride around on them, however restrictions at Disney are far higher in every regard due to the staggering amount of lawsuits and ignorant people that enter their parks on a daily basis.

In my personal opinion, I just think that Disney is justifyably (sp?) overprotective in every regard, as they should be.

Still don't see a difference. Both are parks that can have high attendance and equally have a large amount of stupid guests that enter the gates. Plus the only guest operated Segways at Disney are at Epcot and most of the riding around is done before the park opens to the GP. Not to mention their Segways top out at around 4 mph if IRC.

And when I hear over protective, the first park I think of is Cedar Point. What could they possibly add seat belts to next that does not already have them?

Yes I have seen this man too. I am usually by Wicked Twister, and he usually comes riding around right by the exit and around the front low zone.

I have seen a couple of people riding around on Segways at the park. I just assumed that they worked there. What idiot would decide, "Today I think that I will ride my large motorized device around a crowded amusement park." It is just rude.

Its funny how this thread can go on and on......:)

Just a dude in a scooter/segway device :)

Ensign Smith said:

My continuing concern is with the speed factor. Any vehicle that tops out at 12 mph is a potential danger when driven by the general public in a heavy pedestrian area such as an amusement park. Now if there were some sort of governor that limits velocity to, say, 5 mph, which is the speed of a brisk walk, then I would feel safer about having that vehicle operating in the same walkways as my child.

That doesn't make sense at all. There are lots of people capable of RUNNING at 12 MPH for short periods of time. Should they have to drag a heavy weight after them to keep them from running that speed and knocking people over? I have no problem driving my 150 MPH top speed Mustang at 20 MPH through a school zone without a governor, I'm sure a Segway can be speed controlled by the rider as well.

Learn physics. A human running at 12mph doesn't have the same linear momentum as does a Segway traveling at that speed. Momentum = mass x velocity, and seeing as how a Segway weights about 120lbs, a person traveling on a Segway has nearly twice the momentum as someone running at that speed.

All that said, running through a crowd at 12mph also makes you an inconsiderate jackass, so your point is doubly moot.

Was running through a crowd really just compared to driving a Segway through a crowd?

99er said:
Was driving a Mustang through a school zone really just compared to driving a Segway through a crowd?

Fixed that for you. :)

Rugrats2001 said:

I have no problem driving my 150 MPH top speed Mustang at 20 MPH through a school zone without a governor, I'm sure a Segway can be speed controlled by the rider as well.

Given the number of arseholes who routinely ignore school zone speed limits, your example largely refutes itself. But, uh, congratulations on personally following traffic laws and not endangering our children.

Ralph Wiggum said:
For someone with no knowledge of their condition telling them they should be confined to a wheelchair if they wish to get around in public is humiliating at best.

AMEN to that!!

To whoever said I didn't want segways in the park... I meant I wouldn't want them for rental for anyone to use. THAT could cause many of the problems mentioned above... like "speeding" and running people over and causing mass chaos or whatever. Example... rental scooters.

I have no problem with people bringing them into the park, like I don't mind people bringing their own strollers, wagons, wheelchairs and scooters into the park. Actually the folks that bring their own are more likely to know how to use them and be courteous in public. (Usually... not all the time though)

The big question is whether a Segway is an assistive device like a wheelchair or scooter, or a fun device like a bike or a skateboard, and how they should be regulated at the entrance. I figure with a handicap placard they should be allowed, and without a placard it should be something worked out in advance by calling Guest Services.

So, if I get a handicap placard for my bike or my skateboard I should be allowed to use it in the park?

Totally. I'm going to get a placard for my crotch rocket, Heelys and unicycle - and ride them all at the same time. And you thought the Running of the Bulls was dangerous before!

deeganator said:

Ralph Wiggum said:
For someone with no knowledge of their condition telling them they should be confined to a wheelchair if they wish to get around in public is humiliating at best.

AMEN to that!!

Not sure how I missed this part before, but CP is not a public place.

That said, it doesn't really matter - you're not allowed to operate any device you desire in a public space, regardless of your handicap. The reason Mr. Segway is being called out is because it's debatable as to whether a Segway is indeed an assistive device.

As someone with both personal experience controlling a Segway (you don't just ride it, you control it), and specific knowledge of the safety policies concerning their operation at the only Disney park where they are allowed onstage, I would feel remiss to not weigh in on the matter.

From personal experience, I can tell you that properly controlling a Segway requires both very good driving skill-sets (alertness, quick reactions, good sight, etc.), and understanding of your body's balance and solid control of your muscle movements. While controlling a Segway is not necessarily physically demanding (you won't be sweating like you were doing a workout), it does require very good muscle control and some balance. The Segway does not do all the work for you, you have to understand how your movements affect its reactions. Also, just like a vehicle, it will not stop immediately. It can stop in a very short distance, but you will not stop in time to avoid someone not watching where they are walking that would step out less than 5ft. in front of you unless you are moving slower than you would walk on the Segway.

Furthermore, the safety policies and guidelines in place at Disney concerning Segways are very strict and concise. You don't get on a Segway as a Cast Member without the proper training, which is a day-long safety course. You will also never see a Segway out on the promenade at EPCOT on crowded days, as there is a (surprisingly low) attendance limit above which Segways cannot be used in the park. Period.

Simply put, these things are not intended for use, and should absolutely not be used by anyone, regardless of training and familiarity with it, in any kind of significant crowd. In addition, I find it very hard to believe that in all but a few very special cases, a Segway would be a suitable transportation option for a disabled person. That view comes from operational experience with Segways, not simply a general opinion based on what I've heard. Regardless, use of a Segway in any significant crowd (say a park with more than 28k people) is, in my view, a safety issue waiting to happen and irresponsible.*

*I have heard and partially recognize the validity of the whole psychological aspect of being forced to be at a lower height than everyone else as a disabled person. However, I consider the safety of many to be of greater concern than elevating someone so they can feel good about themselves. I will not accept that argument in the Segway discussion, or similar device discussions.

+1