Gatekeeper Bins

Dead Sexeh said:
You are saying that hats and sunglasses are a necessity because of skin cancer. You are exaggerating the fact that sun can do harm to you.

The harm sun can do varies from person-to-person, and in fact if you've had 5 or more sunburns, your likelihood of getting melanoma doubles.

So, if you're more likely to get sunburned, you're more likely to get cancer.

Hard to exaggerate when it comes to cancer.

My responses regarding other methods was very tongue-in-cheek, as I've been sensitive to sun my entire life, and am thus intimately familiar with the alternatives, which are few and far between.

Sunscreen is a pretty poor substitute for a hat, as the SPF of most fabric is higher than that of sunscreen, and sweat (which often accompanies being out in the sun) rapidly decreases the efficacy of sunscreen.

Just want to point out that what you have there is a very misleading statistic. Let's say you had a 1/10000 chance of skin cancer and now after your sunburns you now have a 1/5000 or a 0.02% chance increase. This argument you are presenting also ignores all the alternatives that have been pointed out.

Now you are trying to change the argument. You to remember my stance is not go outside without any protection. My stance is there is an easy alternative to protect yourself from the sun.

Dead Sexeh said:
My stance is there is an easy alternative to protect yourself from the sun.

And what are those alternatives? If you've mentioned them, I honestly missed them.

OK guys. I'm starting to NOT read anything Dead Sexeh is posting. Reminds me of others who eventually disappeared.

The Statement you have there could be a little misleading. The base of this disagreement is that without bins you cannot have your hat in line therefore you will suffer skin damage. Option 1 wear your hat and just sit on it, hook it around the belt loop on your pants, or put it down your shirt while riding. Option 2 apply sunscreen before and while in line.

^Thanks for the informative post to help conduct healthy discussion. I really don't see the discussion we are having as an unhealthy one that is hurting the board. Your options on this board is either no one talking, people clamoring about how mean streak needs RMC treatment and that we are getting 500' coaster, or an intellectual discussion about the necessity of a hat while in line. I personally prefer the last option.

Wow....one of the first days the park is closed and this is SERIOUSLY going on?!?!?! T-RAGIC.

Dead Sexeh said:
The base of this disagreement is that without bins you cannot have your hat in line therefore you will suffer skin damage.

Now THAT is a strawman. Never have I made that claim. In fact, I've even pointed out that on other rides with bins, I choose to store my hat down my shirt, but on GK it would get crushed by the restraint, so the bin is a welcome convenience.

Option 1 wear your hat and just sit on it...

Why ruin a perfectly good hat by sitting on it?

...hook it around the belt loop on your pants...

I haven't had an adjustable hat in years, so this doesn't work.

Option 2 apply sunscreen before and while in line.

That's it? Your alternative solution to a hat is to put on sunscreen? Beyond being a poor alternative (SPF-wise), it also is very temporary, especially when sweat is a factor.

Regarding your comments on the likelihood of cancer - double the likelihood is still double the likelihood. And given that cancer sucks, and that I'm prone to getting it, I try to do everything I can to mitigate that risk. I would be stupid not to.

My apologies for the straw man argument there. After rereading this discussion I figured out where the disagreement is. You say a hat is a necessity and i think it is a luxury. Sunscreen is an adequate alternative it a hat just as much as getting a cup of water before getting in line is to having a souvenir cup.

What kind of hat do you wear that can fit down your shirt, but get ruined when sat on?

As for the sunscreen being temporary you can always just apply more.

Just remember that buying two lottery tickets instead of one doubles your chances of winning, but it is still highly unlikely it will happen

DJ - not trying to sound like a jerk but I don't completely follow your sunscreen is a poor alternative to a hat statement. I agree that a hat is better for the parts that it covers but what do you do with the parts of your body that are not protected by your hat? Say your neck and arms. I assume you put sunscreen on them. And even a hat does not completely protect your face (maybe I just wear small hats?) Don't you have to put sunscreen on your face as well? Maybe you have short/no hair so you wear a hat to protect your scalp? I know my wife has gotten a nasty burn on her part line on her head when she went without a hat one time.

Shoving any loose articles down ones shirt is often not secure. The answer; coaster ridin' shorts! If you can not fit your cell phone, car keys, wallet (clutch purse for the ladies), hat, and sunglasses in your cargo pockets, time for a new pair of shorts (or pants).

TIP: If your shorts use buttons, place small items (cell phones, keys, wallets) inside a bag and knot it shut before placing it into your pocket.

P.S. You may think it looks dated, but wearing a boonie hat will save the back of your neck, as well as (usually) fit inside your pocket better.

Fanny pack to put your sunscreen in!

Dead Sexeh said:
Just remember that buying two lottery tickets instead of one doubles your chances of winning, but it is still highly unlikely it will happen

The odds of a caucasian male getting skin cancer are about 70,000 times higher than winning the Mega Millions. So your comparison has some order-of-magnitude issues. :)

My hat is a fitted baseball cap. Sitting on it every ride would destroy the brim before too long.

Shades said:
Don't you have to put sunscreen on your face as well? Maybe you have short/no hair so you wear a hat to protect your scalp?

Beyond the fact that my hair is short and endangered, it's a pain to reapply sunscreen every hour or so. Two hours is too long between reapplications, for me anyway.

Besides, the SPF of most fabric is higher than that of most sunscreen. And even if I were to purchase higher SPF sunscreen, the efficacy beyond SPF 50 is suspect, as I understand it.

Please show me how you came to that number because I don't believe it is correct. I am not saying sit on your hat for every ride, just Gatekeeper. Also I know from experience that a hat doesn't get ruined quickly from doing this.

You could always put more sunscreen on in line.

http://www.rmsunscreen.com/SPF70SunscreenCarabiner.aspx

Incidence rates are about 27 per 100,000. Odds of winning the Mega Millions are 1 in 259,000,000.

You shouldn't need a calculator to see why comparing the two is ridiculous. :)

And I don't know how many times it needs to be pointed out that, for some people, sunscreen alone is not adequate protection against the sun. An SPF at or over 50 has questionable efficacy. That is, wearing SPF50 isn't an improvement over wearing SPF30, according to some studies. Fabric is a far better barrier, without question.

You seem intent on arguing that my position is that GK's bins are necessary, when that has never been my argument. I'm merely pointing out that, for some people (like me), a hat is actually necessary (from a health standpoint) when in line, whereas having liquid in a specific container is not necessary.

djDaemon said:

The odds of a caucasian male getting skin cancer are about 70,000 times higher than winning the Mega Millions.

Depressing thought of the day.

djDaemon said:
Incidence rates are about 27 per 100,000. Odds of winning the Mega Millions are 1 in 259,000,000.

You do realize that these numbers statistically should not be compared together, right? 27 out of 100,000 people getting skin cancer doesn't mean you have a 0.027% chance of getting skin cancer. Also the stat you brought up doesn't factor in the people who do dumb things to increase their chances of getting skin cancer. The double figure is based on the baseline chance of getting skin cancer which is before you add in other factors such as the ones upping the incidence rates to 27 of 100000.

I wasn't comparing the two, just simply using an example that shows how misleading the double the chances stat can be. It can sometimes be a very minimal increase in chances.

I think the issue here is that you have a very loose definition of necessary.

Can we just agree that some people like hats and some like sunscreen and move on?

Reading this thread, I have to keep reminding myself that "If you don't have anything nice to say, you shouldn't say anything at all." Sigh.

But what about the people who like both hats and sunscreen? You seem to be excluding them;P

I scream, you scream, we all scream for sunscreen!!