Fast Lane

I always knew there was an hour wait from the pop machines while in line for Millennium Force...now, it's anyone's guess.

Truly, the apocalypse is indeed upon us.

Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!

I don't have a problem with them offering a Fast Lane pass...they just give too much for the price.

I don't know how many times rides were EXTREMELY uncomfortable in the past because the lines were already long...nothing like getting bounced around with a bladder that is about to burst.

Put a cap on the big 3, and no one will be complaining anymore. Well, some people that just have a grudge against CP will.

The cap can be either limit the amount of times using Fast Lane on the ride per day, or 1 ride on the big three per hour. Just prevent the Marathon'ing of the three, and a lot of people will be happy.

oh, and just make the top thrill merge. Want to be able to pick if I want to ride the front or the back train, and where to sit (if they send you front, they tell you what row.....)

I for one am a smidge annoyed at the price raise they suddenly made either yesterday or the day before. I'm going with a small group tomorrow(5 of us), and since we only go maybe three times a year, we are going to splurge on the FL. Just in case we got there and it was miraculously empty in the park, we decided to wait to buy them until we got there and had been there an hour or so. And behold, we now have to pay $10 more. I mean, not that $10 is a lot in the grand scheme of things, but still. That was going to be my elephant ear money.

99er said:

Shades said:
Before Fast Lane everyone was equal, well except for the few VIPs.

And Platinum Pass Holders. Because unless you soent more money, you had no chance of getting first train of the day on Dragster or getting to Maverick first before there was a wait.

You are so right. And based on that logic, before Platinum Passes were in play everyone was equal except for the out of shape people. Everyone knows that when the ropes dropped at 10:00 the out of shape people had no chance of getting onto the 1st train of the day on millennium. I guess someone is always at a disadvantage. Just depends how far you want to reach (and you seem to want to reach pretty far by now saying platinum pass holders have an unfair advantage because they can be on the first train of the day on millennium).

TwistedWicker77 said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only adjustments I've seen made are the increase in price for FL. If people still want to get to the front of the line, they will pay that amount no matter what, which will result in the same thing we've seen demonstrated so far as the season progresses with larger crowds in the busier months.

But people have been able to get to the front of the line for years and years with the VIP program, so price does make a difference.

coasterswim said:

TwistedWicker77 said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only adjustments I've seen made are the increase in price for FL. If people still want to get to the front of the line, they will pay that amount no matter what, which will result in the same thing we've seen demonstrated so far as the season progresses with larger crowds in the busier months.

But people have been able to get to the front of the line for years and years with the VIP program, so price does make a difference.

VIP tours are way more limited than Fast Lane is, plus VIP tours decreased ride capacity by a fraction of a percent, while Fast Lane is decreasing ride capacity by a substantial amount. The price doesn't bother me they could lower it to $20, I still probably wouldn't buy it anyway, I don't buy Lo-Q, or Universal Express either, my splurge is/has been food and meal plans (especially Universal's Yum!,) lol.

Shades said:
I guess someone is always at a disadvantage.

This was my point. There will always be something that is just out of reach for some but within reach for others, just like court side NBA tickets. It has been this way for along time at Cedar Point so why now is it so obvious to everyone with Fastlane?

and you seem to want to reach pretty far by now saying platinum pass holders have an unfair advantage because they can be on the first train of the day on millennium).

I wouldn't call it reaching that far considering I have already seen bitching on this site from Platinum Pass holders about not getting on the first train of the day on Dragster because of Fastlane. Why are PLATINUM Pass holders doing so much whining over this thing?

UpsideDown said:

coasterswim said:

TwistedWicker77 said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only adjustments I've seen made are the increase in price for FL. If people still want to get to the front of the line, they will pay that amount no matter what, which will result in the same thing we've seen demonstrated so far as the season progresses with larger crowds in the busier months.

But people have been able to get to the front of the line for years and years with the VIP program, so price does make a difference.

VIP tours are way more limited than Fast Lane is, plus VIP tours decreased ride capacity by a fraction of a percent, while Fast Lane is decreasing ride capacity by a substantial amount. The price doesn't bother me they could lower it to $20, I still probably wouldn't buy it anyway, I don't buy Lo-Q, or Universal Express either, my splurge is/has been food and meal plans (especially Universal's Yum!,) lol.

Thanks for the back up! VIP guests are waaaaaay more limited to their riding than FL users.

I'm done talking about it because it won't get anywhere. I mean I see some good things proposed about FL, but I'm still not convinced or for it.

They could always do it the way Kennywood dose their "VIP Coaster Tour." You are scheduled a time to be at the exit and that's when you ride. They limit it to One full train a half hour to an hour depending on how many they sell.

Of all the "skip the line" systems out there, Kennywood's is easily my favorite. Low tech and structured well enough to keep the guests skipping the lines spread around at various rides. I would have bought it myself when I was there last year, but the second ride session ran later than we wanted to stay for.

It seems to me that most of the complaints noted here (as well as what I've observed in person) mostly have to do with the regular queue slowing down considerably due to Fast Lane users. I believe that is a problem the park will figure out how to fix in due time, so I'm not willing to make a big deal about it just yet.

Will this new system ever have an absolute zero impact on the guests in the regular queue? Probably not. But if they can get it to the point where it adds 10-15 minutes to an hour long wait instead of 30+ minutes, I think most guests will probably never notice.

With the logic that they should do away with or limit fast lane rides. I live far away from CP and I would like everyone who lives far away from CP to join me in the same logic that they should also do away with the season pass or limit it to four vists. Why should i pay 40 for one day when others pay 100 and can go a hundred times. Not fair I say! Everyone has to pay 40 everytime they go to the park. Join me please and lets get season pass eliminated on the grounds that it is unfair to others. Dont say I can buy a season pass cause you can also buy FL. No more season pass! No more season pass! LOL at all you. Everyone call park operations now and insist no more season passes! If I cant have it, it is totally unfair. Dont you know the world revolves around me? Me..me..me..me

I am curious and dont know if this has been answered, but how many FastLane passes are available each day?

TwistedWicker77 said:
How is it conjecture when I can't solely demonstrate to you in an online forum?

You haven't demonstrated anything at all. You've made some completely unsubstantiated claims about FL's impact, but you've not provided any objective data to support said claims.

What would be another explanation as to why wait times have become as long as they are this season?

Nice weather leading to larger crowds. Less than optimal ride crew efficiency. And, of course, there's confirmation bias - it's clear you've already made up your mind that FL is a terrible, awful thing, so of course you're going to "see" all the negative impact FL brings, even if there really isn't any negative impact.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only adjustments I've seen made are the increase in price for FL.

Based on what's been reported, you're wrong. In addition to the price increase, they've changed the mix of FL and standard queue riders on TTD, meaning there's no longer a 50%-50% mix of FL and standard riders, and thus, waits have not doubled.

If this system was first tried out over at KI for the entire last season, shouldn't the kinks be somewhat worked out by now?

Different park, different rides, different capacities, different mix of guests. Kinzel made the mistake of assuming one size fits all when it comes to amusement parks scattered across the continent.

If I remember correctly from working at CP, the number was estimated at around either 30% or 40% of guests do not ride rides

And even at that rate, selling FL to 20% of guests would not result in waits being doubled across the FL lineup.

What data records do I need...
You really shouldn't rely too much on data.

Please never run an amusement park. :)

Data is key, and I would bet a lot of money that CP is not only collecting tons of it with regard to FL, but is also scrutinizing it closely. That they've bumped the price of FL already suggests as much.

These would ALL only be assumptions if I haven't been to the park yet to experience it myself...
You don't need data to remind yourself that the wait time has increased.

Actually, you do need data to make such a determination, and until you have that data, you're still making assumptions.

What you're basing your assumptions on is subjective, incomplete observation. You don't know anything beyond two points of data - FL exists, and you saw people using it. You don't know that your wait was necessarily longer due to FL - for all you know, all those FL users might have been in line in front of you anyway. I agree it's likely that it was longer (though not double), but you just don't have the data to make that determination, and neither do I. You're jumping to conclusions.

flstc said:
Why should i pay 40 for one day when others pay 100 and can go a hundred times. Not fair I say! Everyone has to pay 40 everytime they go to the park. Join me please and lets get season pass eliminated on the grounds that it is unfair to others.

No, you don't have to eliminate season passes, just increase the price of a season pass to $700, that way so few guests will have season passes they won't even be noticed flashing their passes at the entrance gate. And, do not let them use their passes whenever they feel like it. Limit season pass admissions to 1 day per week. That way they won't abuse the system, no one will be going to Cedar Point three or four days in a row with a season pass and upsetting those guests who have purchased tickets for each day.

UpsideDown said:
VIP tours are way more limited than Fast Lane is, plus VIP tours decreased ride capacity by a fraction of a percent, while Fast Lane is decreasing ride capacity by a substantial amount.

Ride capacity doesn't change. Ever. A ride can either give a thousand rides per hour or it can't. It doesn't matter if those people come from one line, two lines or dropped in to the station via helicopter.

I guess I'm NOT done -_-

You haven't demonstrated anything at all. You've made some completely unsubstantiated claims about FL's impact, but you've not provided any objective data to support said claims.

Your demonstrations and substantial claims are where? In your head because you already have your mind made up that FL is the best thing to happen to the park since hearing that Kinzel is retiring I'm sure.

Nice weather leading to larger crowds. Less than optimal ride crew efficiency. And, of course, there's confirmation bias - it's clear you've already made up your mind that FL is a terrible, awful thing, so of course you're going to "see" all the negative impact FL brings, even if there really isn't any negative impact.

Less than optimal ride crew efficiency? Please! There's a whole WEEK dedicated to training the crew on the ride before the park even opens. When you're a ride host, there is a 90% chance you will be working on more than 3 rides the entire season, and you don't get a full week to train on every ride...rather, an hour before the park opens to train with the Team Leader. If you're talking about lack of staffing, the managers do a good job to assure all rides are fully staffed by opening day so they can run a full line and breaks by 11:30. Finally, I already mentioned that the nice weather we've had so far this season has played a good role in why attendance has been boosted thus far. So you're kinda failing to provide information that I already know.

Based on what's been reported, you're wrong. In addition to the price increase, they've changed the mix of FL and standard queue riders on TTD, meaning there's no longer a 50%-50% mix of FL and standard riders, and thus, waits have not doubled.

Reported by who? Somebody from this forum, or somebody you know personally who came back and reported to you? Because if that's the case, then that isn't accurate data according to your previous posts. If it has been reported by the park, then I stand corrected yet satisfied at the same time. Like I said before, I'm not the only one who has noticed the drastic change in wait time for the big 3 (Not just TTD my friend). The park had to have changed the 50-50 mix because they knew guests weren't satisfied with waiting for so long. Which is what I've been trying to say this whole time.

Different park...Kinzel made the mistake of assuming one size fits all when it comes to amusement parks scattered across the continent.

I sure hope you don't run an Amusement Park either, because you seem to always point the finger at somebody else when you don't agree with something. You have to realize Oiumet had a say in what goes down for FL too.

And even at that rate, selling FL to 20% of guests would not result in waits being doubled across the FL lineup.

I can't believe you're still stuck on the whole lines being double comment. Let's time travel a bit back to last year while in line for Dragster. 2 trains were being loaded by standard guests, and let's just say it equals up to an hour wait if you're backed up to about the 3rd set of block queues. This year, I'm at the same spot, but they're only allowing FL riders to enter the front train while standard guests have to wait for the back train (disregard the supposed recent changes they just made with the mix of FL and standard riders, because my comment first originated before these said changes took place). Now, since you can have unlimited rides with your FL pass, FL guests are going to continue to get back in line, making the FL queue long enough to continue to fill the front loading train up each loading interval. Now that the capacity for standard riders is cut in half, it will indeed double the wait time for standard riders, making my wait an extra hour.

Data is key, and I would bet a lot of money that CP is not only collecting tons of it with regard to FL, but is also scrutinizing it closely. That they've bumped the price of FL already suggests as much.

The only data that is probably being collected, is the difference between non-turnstile guests (FL riders) vs. turnstile guests (standard riders). That is not the "tons" of data you are suggesting in order for CP to determine they need to raise the price, or change the mix of FL and standard. Like I mentioned before, I'm sure the decisions were made because of guest interaction and seeing it for themselves

Actually, you do need data to make such a determination, and until you have that data, you're still making assumptions.

See, you're always looking for facts and data, but until you provide a good explanation as to why I "do", your replies are redundant

What you're basing your assumptions on is subjective, incomplete observation. You don't know anything beyond two points of data - FL exists, and you saw people using it. You don't know that your wait was necessarily longer due to FL - for all you know, all those FL users might have been in line in front of you anyway. I agree it's likely that it was longer (though not double), but you just don't have the data to make that determination, and neither do I. You're jumping to conclusions.

Refer back to my example of waiting in line for Dragster last year opposed to this year. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to look at your watch and be able to tell you have been waiting in line double the time. It's not jumping to conclusions when I have noticed the lines at a standstill all 3 times I've been to the park so far.

Jeff said:

UpsideDown said:
VIP tours are way more limited than Fast Lane is, plus VIP tours decreased ride capacity by a fraction of a percent, while Fast Lane is decreasing ride capacity by a substantial amount.

Ride capacity doesn't change. Ever. A ride can either give a thousand rides per hour or it can't. It doesn't matter if those people come from one line, two lines or dropped in to the station via helicopter.

I agree 100% with your comment about ride capacity not changing.But the V.I.P. Tours had no real impact on wait times.

My wife and I did do the V.I.P. tour once, to keep my dad from having to wait on lines.

When we started out in the morning the ground rules were that, if a coaster had a line,we could do 2 rides (front/back,etc.) but then we had to go to another ride or wait at least 30 minutes for another "lap".Seems to me this should apply ot FL.

I've not made any proclamations regarding FL. I'm merely pointing out that your proclamations lack supporting facts.

As for TTD, again, they're no longer reserving the entire front loading platform for FL riders. They're now mixing FL riders with standard riders in the front, while the back is entirely standard. That results in not doubling the wait. The math is pretty straightforward.