Could CP Support a Concert Venue?

Something along the lines of Timberwolf at KI or the Carowinds Paladium. I know the Timberwolf at least doesn't really get headlining acts anymore since Riverbend opened, but they still get acts, and any big stage event is good for the park no matter how you cut it. Besides, "Live at Cedar Point" does have somewhat of a nice ring to it.

The elephant in the living room with this though, is that I've really got no idea where in the park you could put one. (I'm not calling Celebration Plaza one, since a permanent venue would imply permanent seats, a bigger stage with permanent rigging , that sort of thing.) That and the topography of the peninsula doesn't really lend itself to the natural contour you'd need for an amphitheater either.

Unrealistically, a stage in the Mean Streak infield would at least be visually impressive, if not really feasible. Realistically, the only other place I could see one would be by taking out some of the parking out front, but then you run into the geography problem again. So I guess I've really answered my question, in a way. As much as it'd be a bonus for CP in terms of drawing people, there's honestly just no place to put one that'd work.

If you've been there when they do the festival in the Soak City lot (paid for largely by the promoter, as I understand it), it sucks for the rest of the people visiting the park.

I've avoided Pointfest weekend ever since they've started it because of the horror stories I've heard about the quality of the crowds at Disney's Night of Joy. Now that Cedar Point has had a few Pointfests how does it affect the crowds?

After working at a large arena for the last 9-months (supports 18,000-21,000) that doubles as a concert venue, I can tell you that, from a land standpoint, as well as an Event Services standpoint, Cedar Point does not have the resources to run an adequte concert venue could actually suppport any reasonable concert.

The amount of backstage work and security that most guests don't even see is what makes the show run smoothly, and with their budget and manpower, like I said before, CP cannot support large concerts on the level that KI and Carowinds could (though from what I've heard, those concerts aren't too conducive to large concerts either)

Your assumptions don't make sense. Of course they don't have the resources today. If they chose to endeavor in such events, they would have to put those resources in place as part of the cost of doing business.

I was rather pointing out that they currently don't have the resources, which is obvious, but if you think about it, hiring the amount of people it takes to run a concert venue for the amount of people that Cedar Point would require is a waste of resources.

How often does Timberwolf even get used anyway? 5-6 times during the season, max?

I think they do have the resources for it currently. The main thing they would need is the venue (the actual building/stage). They have in house PR and marketing. They already have a maintenance team and janitorial staff. Event planners and promoters are a dime a dozen, and there are two large security/event staff companies in Cleveland and Columbus. I work for the one in Columbus (they have a satellite office in BG) and we handle security, ushering, parking and almost anything else you might need. We work on an as needed basis, so that keeps costs down. The venue tells us how many people they think they'll need for the event and we make it work.

They could easily accommodate a concert venue, but RideWarrior18 is right, it wouldn't get used enough to put the resources into it.

That being said... Lyman Harbor has plenty of space and they hold all kinds of events there. It's got a great view of the Cedar Point skyline and I've been to a few great concerts there. Maybe the park and Lyman could work something out.

^CSC could easily do security, but the arena that I work for decided to go in-house to keep down costs, as those contractors are expensive. They could make it work on a temporary basis, as the have in the past. But permanently, it just isn't a fesible option at the park.

Krafty said:
I've avoided Pointfest weekend ever since they've started it because of the horror stories I've heard about the quality of the crowds at Disney's Night of Joy.

I don't understand....that's like saying you avoid taco bell because you heard (not tasted) the food at McDonald's was bad.

I've actually been to CP for all three days of the Pointfest weekends the past 3 years (or maybe 2, I can't remember)

The crowd levels were excellent, being that it's early in the HW season, the weather is nice, and from our site in camper village, the music sounds great too. I've already made my reservations for this year.

The only possible downside I can envision is that there is less parking available in that lot. Still, there is more space available than some of the more crowded weekends, particularly the first and second weekends of October.

I've never noticed anything particularly bad about the Pointfest crowds, unless teenagers wearing youth group/church t-shirts scare you. In fact, that weekend has felt like one of the lighter Halloweekends crowds over the past few years.

Ralph Wiggum said:
I've never noticed anything particularly bad about the Pointfest crowds, unless teenagers wearing youth group/church t-shirts scare you. In fact, that weekend has felt like one of the lighter Halloweekends crowds over the past few years.

Ralph I think on our side of the park it was one of the worst crowds we have. Not the busiest but the worst people, the meanest, roughest crowds. Not implying anything but it seemed like that happened for us whenever they had the religious concerts. The people that showed up during at after the concert were vicious and mean, and that holds true even with keeping certain people on a leash and warning everybody to not fan the flames and heckle people on those nights.

Similar venue, similar event. The behavior Josh described is exactly what I found reported when I was researching Night of Joy week at Disney a few years back.

I usually attend 5 out of the 7 HW at CP each year. If you want to talk about trouble, and mean people, you clearly missed the weekend last year with all the fights. I want to say it was one of the last weekends. Search on here for fights on a Saturday. It was one of the worst days in the park I can recall.

Pointfest is always my favorite of the HW, and I don't even go to the concert.

Those fights were generally an exception, we've always got stuff like that happen during HW, but obviously not to that scale in prior years. Generally speaking the Pointfest weekend is great, until the concert let's out. While it's running, the park is pretty open, not a ton of people there usually and then like clockwork the concert ends and we'd get hit with what I described above. I'm a tolerant man, but I can only be told I'm going to hell so many times before it gets old. On top of that, I can tell which of the people were doing it jokingly because I'm a demon hellspawn thing who's job it is to scare them and the people who are serious because I took a job that has me glorifying the devil, etc, etc.

All that being said, there are also still plenty of nice polite people and I'm not saying everybody exhibits that behavior or that it is unique to that weekend, it's just... amplified.

I think it'd be too hard to have a venue inside the park having to try to mingle people who might be going to a concert but not the park and vice versa, and where do you park everybody? So the easiest viable time would be to do it somewhere on point (inside) during the offseason, but by that point there's nobody around and for people who might travel to CP for a concert it's just as easy if not a shorter drive to get to toledo or cleveland or columbus for a concet.

The only way the park could ever support a concert of some kind, in my opinion, is if they had something like the All Wheels stadium just bigger. Holding one on the midway out in the open just wouldn't work.

josh88 said:

Ralph I think on our side of the park it was one of the worst crowds we have. Not the busiest but the worst people, the meanest, roughest crowds.

I was speaking strictly of things other guests would probably notice. If we're talking about how they act towards the Screamsters, then yes, I completely agree with you. Then again, my experiences on the midway while out of costume are during the day, when a many (but not all) of the attendees are at the concert.

It seems if anyone thought this was a good idea they would be doing it already. They already have 2 "stadiums". Zeek mentioned All Wheels stadium but they also have the old IMAX threater where they have the Snoopy Ice Show ( Have no idea what the capacity is but if the took out the middle wall with the doors it doubles in size). . I don't know exactly how big you want the thing but I hardly think even in the summer time the Sandusky area could support any other arena bigger than the 2 already in the park. It really is a question of demand for such a facility, not any other logistical problem.

The All Wheels and Good Time Theater hold about 900. You wouldn't be able to take out the "middle wall" of Good Time because it's a load bearing wall. Not to mention both of the shows that go on there get good numbers through out the year. I had mentioned that something LIKE All Wheels stadium would work if it were bigger, like other parks have. But for something that big there just isn't any room.

Personally, I don't think the park would gain much from adding a concert venue. I think the only reason they do Pointfest is because they only need to provide a space for the show. Everything else comes from the promoter aside from a few Park Services employees. So in the future we could see more concerts held at the park but I think they will be in the form of a touring show that only needs a large flat area to load in all their gear.

But the original question was could the park support a venue. They could support anything they wanted with enough money. If the amount of money brought in by a venue could justify the money needed to run it, then why not do it?

Zeek said:
The All Wheels and Good Time Theater hold about 900. You wouldn't be able to take out the "middle wall" of Good Time because it's a load bearing wall. Not to mention both of the shows that go on there get good numbers through out the year.

Oh for the love of God. Taking out the middle wall implies minor restructuring. The only "load" the middle wall has is the roof. There is not a 10 story building on top of it. A few support beams would have minimal impact on views; not to mention they could mearly remove the roof in part or entirely for an open air venue. Why would the current shows have to be moved because of a minor restructure?

Again, I really don't know how big of a facility you are talking about. I admit moving Cleveland Browns Stadium to the Point would present a few logistical problems. Exactly what types of events besides Pointfest do you envision coming? A Lady Gaga concert? The Good Time Theater is roughly the size of most rural county fair grandstands and they often book fairly big name country music acts each year. Better to have a smaller facility that sells out than a behemoth building that is under utilized.