Intanim Vs. Arrow
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Cernelli... don't believe everything you read. The whole thing is fiction. For competitive reasons no park is going to offer the access that those two clowns say they had. Unless Arrow is being forced to do a "make good" like they did with PKI's Bat, there's no way they're going to mess with them again.
Of course, the possibility that we all could fear is that they've asked Arrow to reprofile the ride. That would be a frightening proposition!
I think the NAPHA members are on crack or all live near Pittsburgh. In fact, that organization in general is very old-school and traditional compared to what I think popular opinion is. I love Thunderbolt as well, but number one coaster period? I don't think so.
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Jeff
Webmaster/Guide to The Point
Millennium Force laps: 35
Of course, the possibility that we all could fear is that they've asked Arrow to reprofile the ride. That would be a frightening proposition!
I think the NAPHA members are on crack or all live near Pittsburgh. In fact, that organization in general is very old-school and traditional compared to what I think popular opinion is. I love Thunderbolt as well, but number one coaster period? I don't think so.
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Jeff
Webmaster/Guide to The Point
Millennium Force laps: 35
You are acting like the Steel Phantom is some horrible coaster, and that Kennywood should hate Arrow for building such a piece of crap in their park. I don't know about you guys, but down here, we love the Phantom and we'll definately miss it. I'm no fan of Arrow, and maybe that site could have, although I highly doubt, made that story up, you simply can't rule out Arrow by saying that Kennywood will never deal with them again. I wish some official information would come out soon so we can stop trying to predict what is going in. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
You people need to stop thinking that Arrow is out of the RC picture. Arrow dynamics Started this coaster war. And is NOT gonna go down without a fight. Someone just needs to give them a chance. cough...Kennywood...cough
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Went Full Force: 2
Kicked The Sky: 5
Stood up to it: 4
Magnum:10, MeanS: 5
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Went Full Force: 2
Kicked The Sky: 5
Stood up to it: 4
Magnum:10, MeanS: 5
It's certainly not impossible, but it's far from likely as well. I'm not passionate about it one way or another, but far too often coaster nuts seem to forget that amusement parks are businesses. What is fun and games for us is their livelihood, the very thing that puts food on their table. The only thing that anyone is loyal to in business is money. Sad but true.
Did the guys on that site make the stuff up? Why not... people are visiting their site, aren't they?
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Jeff
Webmaster/Guide to The Point
Millennium Force laps: 35
Did the guys on that site make the stuff up? Why not... people are visiting their site, aren't they?
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Jeff
Webmaster/Guide to The Point
Millennium Force laps: 35
Why wouldn't Kennywood build an Arrow coaster? And saying that the Steel Phantom 'failed in 9 years' isn't an acceptable answer. That coaster didn't fail. Kennywood is known for their 3 great wooden coasters, and, I feel, the Steel Phantom put them on the map with a great steel coaster, as well.
I just don't see why you think Kennywood wouldn't build another Arrow coaster, because the last one was fantastic.
I just don't see why you think Kennywood wouldn't build another Arrow coaster, because the last one was fantastic.
Okay here is the thing, even though I have never ridden Steel Phantom, from what I am hearing it is tearible.
Why is it that every single ride review I have read on the ride is bad. It doesn't even rank in the top ten. Arrow Dynamic is a great company and I do see them coming back. But unless they change the way they make their roller coasters I see another down fall. Thats only if Arrow is going to make this coaster.
Steel Phantom was made to break a record, so was Despordo and Pepsi Max Big One. And all these coasters usually recive bad reviews. Almost never do they come up in a top 5 coaster poll. I am going to try and quote Jeff again but correct me if I am wrong. "Magnum's success was an accident." All other hyper coasters made by Arrow Dynamics are just not very good. I don't care what anyone says about "I don't know about you guys, but down here, we love the Phantom and we'll definately miss it." If everyone loved Steel Phantom then the roller coaster would not about to torn down. As for NAPHA. I would also have to agree with Jeff, They are either all on some LSD, PCP, Angel dust, Crack, Weed, somthing. Or they live near Kennywood. Steel Phantom doesn't even need to be on a top 10. Magnum in my opinion should have been number 1. Not because I like the ride, but because if you look at any roller coaster poll on the net you will see that Magnum is number 1. Even on the Discovery site it was number 1. Classic coasters are okay but Magnum was cheated. I am going to end this notation
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Millennium Force Rides:2
Magnum XL-200 Drop:3
Why is it that every single ride review I have read on the ride is bad. It doesn't even rank in the top ten. Arrow Dynamic is a great company and I do see them coming back. But unless they change the way they make their roller coasters I see another down fall. Thats only if Arrow is going to make this coaster.
Steel Phantom was made to break a record, so was Despordo and Pepsi Max Big One. And all these coasters usually recive bad reviews. Almost never do they come up in a top 5 coaster poll. I am going to try and quote Jeff again but correct me if I am wrong. "Magnum's success was an accident." All other hyper coasters made by Arrow Dynamics are just not very good. I don't care what anyone says about "I don't know about you guys, but down here, we love the Phantom and we'll definately miss it." If everyone loved Steel Phantom then the roller coaster would not about to torn down. As for NAPHA. I would also have to agree with Jeff, They are either all on some LSD, PCP, Angel dust, Crack, Weed, somthing. Or they live near Kennywood. Steel Phantom doesn't even need to be on a top 10. Magnum in my opinion should have been number 1. Not because I like the ride, but because if you look at any roller coaster poll on the net you will see that Magnum is number 1. Even on the Discovery site it was number 1. Classic coasters are okay but Magnum was cheated. I am going to end this notation
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Millennium Force Rides:2
Magnum XL-200 Drop:3
I guess you just don't understand...
The Steel Phantom is NOT being taken out because it's a "bad" ride or because "nobody likes it"--it's being taken out because Kennywood has to try to stay competitive in the Coaster World. There is really NO room at Kennywood to put another coaster without taking something out.
As for every ride review you've ever read being bad, you must have read reviews from an anti-Steel Phantom or anti-Kennywood group; Everybody that I've ever talked to that has actually been on the coaster has loved it, just loved it. It really is well-liked! When the announcement came that it was going to be taken out, it was all over the news, and there was a ton of public outcry against the decision, but it's final--and NOT due to it being a 'terrible, disliked ride'.
I, myself, can't be the person to say whether or not it's #1 in the world or #2 or #149 - I haven't been on enough coasters. But you've never been on it, period! It's certainly not your place to judge.
Lastly, regarding everybody's comments about NAPHA, by saying that they use drugs and/or live in western Pennsylvania is just taking cheap shots against that organization, and moreover against Kennywood Park, the Steel Phantom, and the Thunderbolt themselves. That's terrible.
The Steel Phantom is NOT being taken out because it's a "bad" ride or because "nobody likes it"--it's being taken out because Kennywood has to try to stay competitive in the Coaster World. There is really NO room at Kennywood to put another coaster without taking something out.
As for every ride review you've ever read being bad, you must have read reviews from an anti-Steel Phantom or anti-Kennywood group; Everybody that I've ever talked to that has actually been on the coaster has loved it, just loved it. It really is well-liked! When the announcement came that it was going to be taken out, it was all over the news, and there was a ton of public outcry against the decision, but it's final--and NOT due to it being a 'terrible, disliked ride'.
I, myself, can't be the person to say whether or not it's #1 in the world or #2 or #149 - I haven't been on enough coasters. But you've never been on it, period! It's certainly not your place to judge.
Lastly, regarding everybody's comments about NAPHA, by saying that they use drugs and/or live in western Pennsylvania is just taking cheap shots against that organization, and moreover against Kennywood Park, the Steel Phantom, and the Thunderbolt themselves. That's terrible.
I am sorry but I just do not agree.
First I cannot believe that you would say that every review I have ever read was an Anti-Kennywood review. Please. If it is a bad coaster it is a bad coaster. Second if Steel Phantom is so good then why doesn't Kennywood just expand on its parking lot. If my parks tradmark roller coaster was just so good and so many people were riding it then why tear it down. Thats like Cedar Point demolishing Magnum because there was no room for Millennium Force. Now it is true, I have never been on Steel Phantom but what I hear is what I hear. I have not hear one good review on Steel Phantom yet. But one thing is for sure. I have never heard of a park that got rid of a good coaster. Build above
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Millennium Force Rides:2
Magnum XL-200 Drop:3
First I cannot believe that you would say that every review I have ever read was an Anti-Kennywood review. Please. If it is a bad coaster it is a bad coaster. Second if Steel Phantom is so good then why doesn't Kennywood just expand on its parking lot. If my parks tradmark roller coaster was just so good and so many people were riding it then why tear it down. Thats like Cedar Point demolishing Magnum because there was no room for Millennium Force. Now it is true, I have never been on Steel Phantom but what I hear is what I hear. I have not hear one good review on Steel Phantom yet. But one thing is for sure. I have never heard of a park that got rid of a good coaster. Build above
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Millennium Force Rides:2
Magnum XL-200 Drop:3
Ok, I'll jump in. Kennywood DOES have a space problem but it's not QUITE as severe as everyone seems to think. I can remember back when they were taking out the Laser Loop to put in the Steel Phantom, we were all like "where do they have space for THAT?" The answer is, clever layouts. The 2nd drop on Phantom, which goes THROUGH the Thunderbolt, is still one of my favorite drops anywhere, and I can't wait to see if the new ride uses something similar.
I'll miss the Steel Phantom, but it's time to let it go. Since Kennywood IS limited on space, AND wants to put in something "better", I have no problem with this. Phantom has gotten rougher and rougher over the years (although I still feel that it's running better this year than it has in a LONG time, it's not beating me up anymore). It doesn't draw many riders anymore (I was at the park yesterday, and all 3 woodies had much longer waits than Phantom did), I've been hearing it's getting expensive to maintain (cracks that require rewelding, etc.) as well. Kennywood's a business -- if the ride ends up COSTING them money net (expenses vs revenue), it's time to do something different.
Phantom's problems mostly stem from comparatively rough track, poor transitions, and inversions that don't really work for this ride (a LARGE loop at those speeds may not be as bad, but it's got the typical tight Arrow teardrop). The horsecollar restraints combined with the sudden transitions and rough track can make for a rough ride.
That doesn't make it a BAD coaster. I actually LIKE Phantom. But if Kennywood can use the room for a BETTER coaster, so be it. And if it IS Arrow (which I have major doubts about), then I'll give Arrow the benefit of the doubt and hope they've learned from past mistakes.
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--Greg
http://www.pobox.com/~gregleg/
2000 MF count: 4
2000 SP count: 5
Full counts: http://gregleg.dhs.org:2000/CoasterCount.html *** This post was edited by GregLeg1 on 7/16/2000. ***
I'll miss the Steel Phantom, but it's time to let it go. Since Kennywood IS limited on space, AND wants to put in something "better", I have no problem with this. Phantom has gotten rougher and rougher over the years (although I still feel that it's running better this year than it has in a LONG time, it's not beating me up anymore). It doesn't draw many riders anymore (I was at the park yesterday, and all 3 woodies had much longer waits than Phantom did), I've been hearing it's getting expensive to maintain (cracks that require rewelding, etc.) as well. Kennywood's a business -- if the ride ends up COSTING them money net (expenses vs revenue), it's time to do something different.
Phantom's problems mostly stem from comparatively rough track, poor transitions, and inversions that don't really work for this ride (a LARGE loop at those speeds may not be as bad, but it's got the typical tight Arrow teardrop). The horsecollar restraints combined with the sudden transitions and rough track can make for a rough ride.
That doesn't make it a BAD coaster. I actually LIKE Phantom. But if Kennywood can use the room for a BETTER coaster, so be it. And if it IS Arrow (which I have major doubts about), then I'll give Arrow the benefit of the doubt and hope they've learned from past mistakes.
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--Greg
http://www.pobox.com/~gregleg/
2000 MF count: 4
2000 SP count: 5
Full counts: http://gregleg.dhs.org:2000/CoasterCount.html *** This post was edited by GregLeg1 on 7/16/2000. ***
I love Kennywood... easily one of my favorite parks. "Failed in nine years" IS an acceptable answer because that's what the park said. When they announced it was over at some off-season ACE event, they flat out said, "Steel Phantom's popularity isn't what it used to be." That sure sounds like failure to me. You bet they want to stay competitive... you can't support capacity or park attendance with a ride that few people want to ride. With a park that local, the vast majority of riders know what to expect, and would rather not ride.
If that wasn't enough, they actually have to wait to fill a single train with enough people to even bother dispatching it, and that's on a busy day. My last visit was on a slow day and I sat in the train for five minutes before dispatch.
It doesn't shock me that the thing is a maintenance nightmare, either. I couldn't believe how many repair welds are all over the area around the first drop. Judging by the way it slams though those trims before the first loop, I wouldn't be surprised if the whole ride was in bad shape.
Like I said, I love Kennywood, but the ride is toast, because it doesn't draw crowds. I'd sooner ride the Jackrabbit. Furthermore, blind passion for Arrow is not something to make a business decision on... but that's a topic for CoasterBuzz...
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Jeff
Webmaster/Guide to The Point
Millennium Force laps: 35
If that wasn't enough, they actually have to wait to fill a single train with enough people to even bother dispatching it, and that's on a busy day. My last visit was on a slow day and I sat in the train for five minutes before dispatch.
It doesn't shock me that the thing is a maintenance nightmare, either. I couldn't believe how many repair welds are all over the area around the first drop. Judging by the way it slams though those trims before the first loop, I wouldn't be surprised if the whole ride was in bad shape.
Like I said, I love Kennywood, but the ride is toast, because it doesn't draw crowds. I'd sooner ride the Jackrabbit. Furthermore, blind passion for Arrow is not something to make a business decision on... but that's a topic for CoasterBuzz...
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Jeff
Webmaster/Guide to The Point
Millennium Force laps: 35
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Closed topic.