Why not a CP Xcelertor?

After reading about KBF's $13 million full-circuit Intamin coaster, I couldn't help feeling disappointed in CP's decision.  Why didn't they build the same thing in Sandusky?

Don't tell me it's because CF doesn't build clones.  There isn't much difference between DP's Steel Force and WoF's Mamba (save for Mamba's lack of tunnels).  CP and VF added Chance Chaos rides the same year. CP and VF both have Arrow loopers named 'Corkscrew'. VF and CP's S&S combo towers have the same name. VF's and KBF's towers would be exactly identical if not for FAA restrictions shortening VF's decorative arches and contractual restrictions preventing KBF from adding a Space Shot option.

CP needs the capacity more than any other park in the chain, with so many visitors in such a (relatively) short season.

I have the bad feeling that we'll all be asking ourselves the same question while we're waiting in line, foreheads streaming sweat in the Sandusky sun.   Why?  Why?  Why?

-CPlaya

Due to the shortness of Knott’s new ride, I doubt the capacity will be that much different then WT.  There might be more trains, but they will probably hold less people (like a Thrust Air).  I don’t see where Knott’s ride will be any better or worse the WT.  They both will give you that nice adrenaline rush because of the fast acceleration.

 

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Bob M.

I too doubt capacity will be much different, but at the same time I'm really intrigued by the new ride at Knott's. Perhaps this will be the reason I finally need to get my butt out there this year!

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Jeff
Webmaster/GTTP, Sillynonsense.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"

Yeah I would love to have seen an Xcelerator type ride at CP, since it is a unique, new thing from Intamin rather than an impulse.  Plus it has a better top speed, accelerates faster, is longer, etc...  Maybe space was the problem.  No, I'm NOT saying that CP has a space problem, but they wanted something on the beach / in Oceana, and I don't know if a ride like Xcelerator would fit there.  Who knows, maybe if Xcelerator is a success we will see one at CP down the road.

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Break the scream barrier in 2002!
Wicked twists: 0

Cedar Fair can't build there best new rides at CP every year. They have other parks that need lots of help!

I wouldn't go as far as calling Xcelerator unique. It sounds to me like a more serious implementation of California Screamin'.

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Jeff
Webmaster/GTTP, Sillynonsense.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"

Jeff, if you were looking for a single reason to get out to KBF, Ghostrider is it. 

I think CF is being very smart for 2002. They're building two rides that are new, unique, and different than their competitors. Wicked Twister is a new implimentation of the impulse design, and XLR8OR is (I think) a brand new ride of it's kind.

And Jeff... Ghostrider at night is great :)

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Tommy Penner - http://coolforce.tycoonplanet.com
"What is the Matrix?"

Why worry about what other parks have and not us. If cp went out to please every single person then we would see 10 new coasters this year.......I think i prove my point
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One Time Me And My Friends Rode The Mine Ride 25 Times In A Row For Fun, And Gave The Ride Op's A Thumbs Up Back. I Think We Annoyed The Heck Outta Them:)

Hey Is Xcelerator gonna be a clone(Same Type I mean) of the "Thrust Air" coaster? Or will the hill up be at a less than 80 degree angle? Just a thought
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One Time Me And My Friends Rode The Mine Ride 25 Times In A Row For Fun, And Gave The Ride Op's A Thumbs Up Back. I Think We Annoyed The Heck Outta Them

*** This post was edited by Cp_Rider on 12/18/2001. ***

The hill will be at 90 degrees, just like the Thrust Airs.  It sounds a lot like a Thrust Air, but Thrust Air is made by S&S and Xcelerator is made by Intamin so it can't be a clone.  Plus, Xcelerator will have those signature Intamin overbanked turns, and a twisting drop.  In addition, unlike the Thrust Airs, Xcelerator uses a hydraulic launch system, which seems faster than LIMs and just about as fast as the air power.  It will be insane!

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Break the scream barrier in 2002!
Wicked twists: 0

*** This post was edited by Majin Heero on 12/17/2001. ***

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Cp_Rider said:
Why worry about what other parks have and not us. If cp went out to please every single person then we would see 10 new coasters this year.......I think i prove my point

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What point is that exactly?

First of all, we're not talking about just 'another park' but a CF sister park.  Secondly, my beef with CP building a shuttle instead of a model isn't about the ride experience...it's about capacity. 

Even if you're too young to remember 2 1/2 hour long waits for the Corkscrew in '76 -- with three trains running -- you still would have to know about the infernal waits for MF in May/June 2000 with 1 or 2 trains on the track.  I'm not convinced WT will be any better.

-CPlaya

*** This post was edited by CoastaPlaya on 12/18/2001. ***

Saying WT is not going to have the capacity of MF is no big revelation.  Everybody knows this.  But what makes you think that Xcelertor will have any better capacity?  And yes, the WT lines will be over 2 hour longs on some days.  But then again, every new ride has 2 hour lines.  It’s not like the lines for WT will grow to 5 hour because it has half the capacity of MF.  There is a limit to how long someone will wait in line, even for a new ride.

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Bob M.

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But what makes you think that Xcelertor will have any better capacity?

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Let's see....not only does Xcelerator have two trains, their launch zone doesn't double as the station.  So our friends on the west coast won't have to deal with rapid loading/unloading of a single train or keeping the brilliant GP clear of the station during the course of the ride.

Funny, I thought that was kinda obvious.

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. It’s not like the lines for WT will grow to 5 hour because it has half the capacity of MF.

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Are you sure?  And would you like to tell that to the folks who attended the 2000 Longaberger picnic or AAA day who waited 3-5 hours for MF?  I think they'd beg to differ...
-CPlaya

*** This post was edited by CoastaPlaya on 12/18/2001. ***

I agree that CF can't always put their most creative coasters at CP, although I hope they do put something like Xcelerator in.  I read reviews of MF on CP's site, and there were a lot of people who waited 3+ hours for MF in 2000.  Fortunately, I wasn't one of them.  I expect the same kind of waits for WT.  But, since I have season passes and JCB, I expect I'll get some ride time without long waits during the ERT's.

CP may be 2 hours from me, but a season pass almost pays for itself in 2 days at the park.

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I'd rather die living than live like I'm dead

Got to spread the wealth....
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Christmas Wish List:
B/M Flyer For 2004...
B/M Flyer For 2004....

It's not like this hasn't happened before folks...
Power Tower (ValleyFair) and Supreme Scream are taller rides than Power Tower (Cedar Point) ya know...

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Jes
Webmaster, Jes's Roller Coasters
"Thank You Jeff Putz"

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CoastaPlaya said:

Let's see....not only does Xcelerator have two trains, their launch zone doesn't double as the station.  So our friends on the west coast won't have to deal with rapid loading/unloading of a single train or keeping the brilliant GP clear of the station during the course of the ride.
Funny, I thought that was kinda obvious.

The WildCat has 7 cars and loading and unloading stations.  It's capacity is 900 rph.   Magnum has 3 trains and one loading/unloading stattion.  It's capacity is 2000 rph.  Number of trains and station configuration are not the only variables when calculating ride capacity.  I thought that was obvious.  We won't really know the capacity of WT or  Xcelertor until both are in operation.
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Bob M.

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So what does comparing a ride with seven tiny 4-passenger cars to a coaster with three huge 36-passenger trains have to do with anything?

Let's stop wasting time grasping for inane and meaningless 'comparisons'...We already know WT has a single 28-passenger train while Xcelerator has 2 20-passenger trains.  We already know more precautions have to be taken with a train whipping through WT's station at 70+ MPH than have to be taken with a full-circuit coaster train easing out of a station.  I don't think we have to count on our fingers and toes or attempt to shrug off the obvious about each ride's capacity, do we?

I'm not saying that WT's ride exprience will be disappointing...nor that CF parks don't represent a good value (especially with my $49 VF passes!) but I can't say good things about the wait in line...especially compared to a certain full-circuit launched Intamin in a less-crowded park.

-CPlaya

PS to Jes - I hear you on the hypers / S&S combos...actually VF's WT is a twitch taller than Magnum (207') and SF and Mamba have 5' longer drops, too.  But I can't say I've noticed a real difference in the first-drop experience due to those variations...nor a distinguishable height difference between CP's and VF's PTs (besides the obvious change in scenery) when I'm at the top with my feet swinging.

But that's not what got me bent out of shape...it's capacity.  You just wouldn't think a park that builds a 3000-pph monster like Gemini would build a WT if they could help it.

*** This post was edited by CoastaPlaya on 12/19/2001. ***

I think people are just trying to say that there are many factors that determine capacity.  Ultimately, the size of the trains AND the dispatch interval determine a coaster's capacity.  Take Millennium Force and Magnum as an example.  Millennium's dispatch interval by my timing is about 1:37.  Magnum's, on the other hand is 1:20.  This means that Magnum can dispatch about 45 times per hour while Millennium only dispatches about 37 times per hour.  Multiply that 8 train difference by 36 people (since both coasters have 36 passenger trains) and you see that Magnum's hourly capacity is higher by aproximately 288 riders per hour.  If somehow Wicked twister had a dispatch of 1:20 (which it won't), then it would have a capacity of only 11% less than Magnum (because of 4 less seats).  I predict that the dispatch interval for WT will be around the 2 minute mark which would be an hourly capacity of 960.  If they could get it down to 1:50, that would be 1,047 pph.

Another point to consider is that this just adds 1,000 to the park-wide capacity.  If you add together the capacities of just some major rides, like Magnum, Millennium, Mantis, Raptor, Mean Streak, and Wicked Twister that is probably over 10,000 riders per hour on just those six rides alone.  There are 62 other rides in the park as well as food, games, shows, etc that all occupy people.  If you added up the hourly capacity for all 68 rides, I'm sure the number would blow some people's minds.  Gemini and Power Tower would add another 4,000 riders easily to the 10,000.  Although WT might not have a huge capacity by itself, it can only help the CP line experience from a park-wide perspective.  I'm sure CP will try to make sure that WT runs as close to its maximum capacity as possible.  It's already been confirmed that there will be six ops on the platform to check restraints.

Lastly, I really don't think WT is going to generate the type of hype that Millennium Force did.  I don't think there will be waits of over two hours.  People just won't enter a line more than that for a ride like this.  I wouldn't even do it for MF honestly.  If you have a problem waiting, get there early and run with the bulls and then ride it last at night.  That's two rides without wasting a significant portion of your day.  By planning your day properly, you can minimize your waits pretty effectively.

Having said all that, I'd definltely be interested in experiencing Xcelerator - probably even more than WT.  But you can't have everything at one park.  CP has more than just about every other park, so be happy.

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-Matt
2001 Magnum Crew

*** This post was edited by MDOmnis on 12/19/2001. ***