why isnt Demon Drop considered a coaster?

sorry if this sounds like a stupid question, but why doesnt Demon Drop count as a coaster? it rolls along on a track, and completes a circuit, right? what criteria does it not meet?

I can see what you are saying about this...but all in all its just a flat ride

Good point, but it just doesn't make sense considering DD a coaster. I'm sure a lot of people would be upset if CP considered it a coaster, kind of a cheap shot. I believe SFMM considers their Superman the Escape ride a coaster but they don't consider their Intamin freefall a coaster when in reality STE resembles a massive Intamin freefall ride.

I don't consider Jr. Gemini a coaster either (it's an extremely slow flat ride), but CP sticks it right on their coaster list so they can stay ahead of SFMM.

As for Superman The Escape, I'd consider that more of a coaster than Jr. Gemini. Wicked Twister doesn't complete a circuit either and it's still considered a coaster. STE and TTD have a lot in common other than one reversing and the other going in a circle. I don't really think of TTD as a coaster in the traditional sense either. It just goes up a tower and comes back down. There are no traditional coaster elements to it at all (at least PKD's Hypersonic has a bunny hop after the first hill). In the end, a coaster seems to be anything the park decides is a coaster. If the DD was installed today, they probably would tout it as a coaster just to get that all-important # of coasters figure up at all costs (their flat rides and other attractions have been suffering badly by their constant need to install more coasters, IMO).

As it is, I think it's been to long for them to start calling it a coaster now. I mean it would look bad for them to suddenly say tomorrow that, "What do you mean we have 16 coasters? We have 17! "

"Oh yeah? What's #17?"

"Demon Drop!"

"But you've had that for decades. You said you had 16 yesterday!?"

It would just look bad.

It's like Dragster... Except that whole important thing that S:TE Doesn't actually make it all the way to the top of the tower (in fact, the day I was there we only went up maybe 2/3 of the way)... and then theres that whole it starts out on the top of a big hill and goes to a tower which is actually at the bottom of the hill, so when it starts its upward ascent, its already 150 feet or so in the air.

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but CP sticks it right on their coaster list so they can stay ahead of SFMM.

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You do understand that every park does this, right?

Example - there's a park in California that has a kiddie roller coaster with the following stats:

Height: 10' (9' feet shorter than Jr. Gemini)
Length: 350' (93' shorter than Jr. Gemini)
Speed: 10 MPH (a whopping 4 MPH faster than Jr. Gemini)

The coaster? Goliath Jr. The location? Your beloved Six Flags Magic Mountain.

*** Edited 8/5/2004 7:34:22 PM UTC by Walt***

What's this "beloved Six Flags Magic Mountain" business? I've never even been there let alone consider it beloved. I just don't dismiss other parks out-of-hand (like blind patriotism or whatever) because I happen to live in Ohio and like CP. And I do like CP. But that silly coaster record thing just leads to other amusement areas getting neglected, IMO. It's not what brings me to CP. It's the QUALITY of the coasters that matters to me and they've got some great ones. They also have some snoozers that I'd rather see get replaced before they start sacrificing other non-coaster rides.

I was more disturbed when Geauga Lake (Six Flags Ohio at the time) removed The Rotor and their Rocket Ship Swing (Trabien Swing?) ride as part of an effort to add more coasters. They now have tons of land they could use on the Sea World Side for some flat rides. I'd like to see those put back somewhere on the park. But they're old-fashioned rides, so don't count on it, especially with the Cedar Fair mentality that seems to tell me that only coasters really matter anymore. I'd like more ride variety at both parks and I'd especially like to see some nice new dark rides added. With modern technology, they could be done really well these days.

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PacDude said:
What's this "beloved Six Flags Magic Mountain" business? I've never even been there let alone consider it beloved.

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I've been to Six Flags Magic Mountain many times and I assure you it in no way compares to Cedar Point. CP deserves every award it ever receives. There's a reason their voted the best year after year.

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They also have some snoozers

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They're only snoozers in your opinion. Everyone has different tastes.

You seemed all bent out of shape that Cedar Point was somehow "cheating" to get some stupid record. I merely pointed out to you that every park does it and showed, as an example, a coaster at SFMM that is "weaker" than Jr. Gemini.

The majority of people here do not have blind loyalty to Cedar Point. You're just picking comments out from a small number of people.

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But that silly coaster record thing just leads to other amusement areas getting neglected, IMO

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Since 1997, Cedar Point has added a 10 story addition to the Breakers, built a new hotel off the Causeway, 7 new kiddie rides, 2 new flat rides, a new thrill ride, the Swan Boats, at least 8 new restaurants or food stands, many new gift shops, opened and then expanded Lighthouse Point, completely renovated the marina, expanded Soak City twice, opened a quality ice show, added an entirely new dimension to the fall with HalloWeekends, and made numerous other improvements that I'm sure I'm missing. In that time, they added 3 roller coasters. Now, how exactly are they focusing on nothing but coasters?

*** Edited 8/5/2004 8:03:46 PM UTC by Walt***

People complain that S:TE is not a coaster because it doesn't make a complete circuit. Yet we are all happy to accept Wicked Twister and Head Spin (formarly Mind Eraser) as coasters.

Oh, and I agree with everything walt just said.

I aslo agree that either CP or GL needs to bring back the Rotor. It was one of my favorite rides. *** Edited 8/5/2004 8:47:06 PM UTC by Jason Hammond***

I can see why you would say WT is not a coaster, but I would say because of the train style, and track style and because it is a certain type of ride, impulse, which is considered a roller coaster, it deserves to be called one. STE is called a freefall ride, a freefall ride is not a coaster, like demondrop. TTD is most definitley a coaster, it just has a different form of propulsion, not chain and gravity but hydraulic launch. It is missing elements because of the newer design and its power. It is a generic version of rocket coasters to come.

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TTDsam said:
STE is called a freefall ride, a freefall ride is not a coaster, like demondrop.

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Check again, SFMM considers their STE a roller coaster NOT a freefall ride (not to be confused with their Intamin freefall ride called "Freefall").

Demon Drop is a drop ride, hence it's name, Demon Drop.

MrScott

THANK YOU Mr. Scott. I think Mr. Scott has proven the point of Demon Drop being a freefall and not a coaster. It's Just that simple. End of story.

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PacDude said:
I don't consider Jr. Gemini a coaster either (it's an extremely slow flat ride), but CP sticks it right on their coaster list so they can stay ahead of SFMM.

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Then what is Jr. Gemini...? A flat ride.

If Demon Drop isn't a coaster, neither is STE. Also, if you don't consider WT a coaster can you really consider Deja Vu a coaster? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that makes a full curcuit either.

Having said that, I really don't care how you classify a ride as long as its a fun ride. Its like the old "Is (fill in the blank) a sport?" argument. Who cares? If I enjoy watching it or doing it, I will.

lol @ walt, that is a good example, I am with you on that. The goliath jr thing. I wouldn't consider Demon Drop a coaster either. It basically is superman the escape but backwards.

It's just an unwritten law about coasters. No one has set standards for what a coaster should be, but most of the time people can tell if it is or if it isn't a roller coaster. Demon Drop just doesn't seem to be a coaster, while to me neither does S:TE. And it does seem like a rip off to add height by using a hill and only going up a bit of the track. So if the ride starts off 150' high, not sure just going by what someone said, then it'd only be about a 250' tall ride, imo. It's like saying that ride on top of Stratosphere is 900 some feet tall.

-Eagle-

I used to critically think about what was a coaster and what wasn't a coaster. In the end, my logical answer was to just call them all RIDES. I'm just glad to visit a great amusement park like CP and enjoy all the attractions. :)

S:TE is completely different than Demon Drop/Freefall. Its as much a coaster as WT or TTD.

Sean: Most coasters don't start and end at ground level, yet their height is still calculated by the distance their supports reach from the ground. The height for Cedar Creek Mine Ride is listed as X feet but we all know you don't get THAT type of drop. TTD is 420 feet yet the drop is really about 400.

Demon Droppin:
Oh common. You mean to tell me you wouldn't prefer ANY of SFMM rides over CPs? Because I could name a few. Just because CPs a great park doesn't mean SFMM isn't.