Under the Station

RideMan,

Am I correct to assume that they are not actualy brake 'calipers' because calipers actually involve physical movement?

www.dictionary.com
"A large instrument having a fixed and a movable arm on a graduated stock"

So are they just brackets??? I know.. I'm being anal..
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MF 2000 - 269 laps

MF 2001 - ???????
*** This post was edited by Red Garter Rob on 2/24/2001. ***

I'm not Rideman, but yes, there is no squeezing of calipers against the fins to stop the trains, just a magnetic flux when the fins pass between the permanent magnets. ("calipers")

So yeah, they're just stationary brackets.

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Trim brakes-a necessity???
(used to be MFistheBEST)
AOL Screen name-SkiDoo8613 *** This post was edited by Chris on 2/24/2001. ***

Chris isn't me, but he is right... :) Actually, the station brake...er...units, and the block brake units do move; a pneumatic cylinder is used to drop the magnets away from the brake fins to make it easier to pull the train through the block.
As Red Garter Rob points out, "caliper" isn't quite the right term for these brakes. Any MF types want to tell us what they're properly called? :)

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

Thanks Rideman.... :) You've taught us all a lot about coasters. Keep up the good work!

I actually did wonder how they pulled the trains out of the brakes too-without it being so hard, thanks for answering that. I know we discussed this way back when, but why do the trains make so much noise when they fly through the brakes? It seems like it should only hum, but it doesn't.

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Trim brakes-a necessity???
(used to be MFistheBEST)
AOL Screen name-SkiDoo8613

"there is no squeezing of calipers against the fins to stop the trains, just a magnetic flux when the fins pass between the permanent magnets"

I'm not sure if saying a "flux" is the right way to phrase it... wouldn't a flux indicate that a current is being generated? Or did i sleep too much in physics last month?

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-The Pants Has Spoken
"Yellow line? What Yellow Line..."

A current is generated. Basically, they are inductors, no?

We're talking here about magnetic flux, not electric flux. According to P. 658 of this here Physics textbook, Electric flux is a measure of the number of electric field lines penetrating some surface. Electric flux refers to a straight-line electric field generated by a charged particle. Or something like that; this is electromagnetic theory which I never understood as well as I know Kinematics. Anyway, p. 848 of the same Physics text explains that magnetic flux is similar, but not quite the same. Primarily, electric flux is uniform through a surface surrounding a net charge. This is not the case for magnetic flux because magnetic flux lines form closed loops, so the magnetic flux is not evenly distributed...because all magnets have two poles, and the magnetic flux passes through both poles.

Yikes! My brain hurts! I slept too much in Physics too...and I took that class in 1990...

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

And, by your book's standards, this would be a magnetic flux because there is a stable ground field at the plates due to the ground strap on each train. (anyone ever notice the unpainted lines on teh top of each track????)

And for the love of god I can't remember what train has what car grounded. I recall a car 3 a car 5 and a car 8. Don't remember which color is which.

Just another one of those stuid things I noticed during Milennium Mania.

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MF 2000 - 269 laps

MF 2001 - ??????? *** This post was edited by Red Garter Rob on 2/26/2001. ***

My head hurts too. The only time I ever heard the word flux mentioned with anything scientific is the flux capacitor in Back to the Future. Hey, they say the future is riding on it and MF does go above 88 MPH, so maybe its equipped for time travel too!

Seriously, isn't flux just a fancy word for flow, or does this flux have something to do more with fluctuate?

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Joe E

Actually, I thought the ground strap was a static drain. You know that most coaster trains are not electrically connected to the track, right? That's why if it is humid and you stick your hand out on the Gemini turnaround you can feel sparks jump between your hand and the outstretched hand of the person on the other train. Millennium Force, on the other hand, has a ground strap behind one of the wheels (I also forget which one...) but I wonder how well it works considering that the track is painted and paint is usually not a conductor...

--Dave Althoff, Jr., whose brain still hurts.

Is the grounding strap for discharging static electricity built up during operation or for the electric lap bar release?

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Scott W. Short
scott@midwestcoastercentral.com
http://www.midwestcoastercentral.com

The grounding straps are totally "after-market."

I don't know that the paint would make that much of a difference in conducting electricity. It's not a very good insulator (ask the computer about lightning). Heck, I get shocked every time I get out of my car.

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Jeff
Webmaster/Guide to The Point
Millennium Force laps: 50

The grounding strap has to be for static discharge. There is a separate busbar in the station for the lap bar release. Besides, I doubt that they would want to do lap bar release with a brush that rubs against the track all the time because the brush would wear out quickly. Not a big deal for a static drain, but a very big deal for the lap bar release.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

My physics teacher and I discussed wether or not a current is generated when the brake fins pass through the magnets. He said it depends on the composition of the magnets (this is assuming they are not electrically grounded). I'm not sure what he's talking about...

Here's another question... If the trains are grounded to the track, when they pass through the brakes, wouldn't a curent be generated in the brake fins and electrify the body of the train?

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-The Pants Has Spoken
"Yellow line? What Yellow Line..."

Ok, I first want to say that I don't post here at all, but every once and a while, I do check CP Place to read CP discussion.

Secondly, I would like to point that Dave's Physics book is correct. An electric field is present where there is some kind of test charge (a particle) that is at rest and feels some kind of electric force force acting on it. The tendency of electric field lines are to extend away from positive charges and head towards negative charges. The intensity of electric fields can be both strong and large depending on the charges that are interacting with each other.

Now, unlike electric charges, magnetic fields are set up by moving electrically charged particles in a wire or something similar to that. The intensity of magnetic fields weaken as the distance from the moving particle is greater. Basically, moving charges can create magnetic fields. Here's where flux comes to play: What happens when you have a current moving through a closed loop of wire? The current in that loop will induce a magnetic field in a direction that will go through the loop. Now, put a magnet through that loop of current and there is a magnetic flux, which will then try to reverse the direction of the original current. I believe I have this correct and perhaps I should go back to my physics book as well to make sure this is right.
after all, flux, magnetic fields, electric fields can be rather complicated physics concepts.
Hope this may help a bit. It's time for me to get back to studying for my finals...
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-Jon Smith

"See ya in the back"

Hey Jon, post more :)

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Scott W. Short
scott@midwestcoastercentral.com
http://www.midwestcoastercentral.com

If I remember correctly, they added the ground straps to prevent damage to the ride control computers by static through the harness release system... Also, there isn't much too say about the 'equipment room' below the load station...just a very large electrical control cabinet and the sound system...
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*2000 - Cedar Downs crew, WildCat/LaserShow crew
*2001 - Cedar Downs assistant team leader

Oh. I thought the ground straps on the train were to keep the riders from getting zapped when entering or exiting the train (static drains).

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

The way maintnance explained it, the trains are already grounded through the harness release system. They explained the system was designed to safely dischsrge a 10,000 volt static charge. But the trains were coming back charged at 25,000+ volts - enough to damage ride systems beyond repair...
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*2000 - Cedar Downs crew, WildCat/LaserShow crew
*2001 - Cedar Downs assistant team leader

That's a lot of volts.

Sure would tickle... :)