Extended Closure

I find it doubtful they were planning any reimagining of the ride prior to the accident, at least in the near future.

If the maintenance costs were high and uptime low, I'm confident that they were already looking for a new way to use the ride.

There was a post on some social media platform from around the opening time where one of the people with Zamperla posted a photo of them sitting in the Charlotte airport and captioned it by talking about how it was the team sitting at a bar in the Charlotte airport X months ago celebrating the TT2 contract having just won it and when you do the math you realize that the X had to have been either the month before the accident or within a couple weeks of the accident happening. I for the life of me can't find this photo or remember where it was posted or by who so I know it may sound made up but I swear it exists. It is also possible it's been taken down by the person and that's why I can't find it as CP may not want people to know it was in the works prior to the accident. If you accept the fact that this photo exists then you can operate under the assumption that there are 2 possible timelines for TT2.

Timeline 1 (one we have been operating under the assumption of): Accident July 2021->RFP sometime after->By August 2022 we are seeing utility markings indicating a winning bid has been chosen and work has started in some form. That means in a year they put out an RFP, had multiple companies design and submit bids, reviewed, negotiated, and selected a winner, and finalized the design and lined up contractors. In my opinion having worked on much smaller projects and seeing how long those took, that is a really tight window.

What I think the original timeline was: Early 2021 RFP goes out. June/July 2021 Zamperla chosen. Late summer 2022 TTD closes and track begins being removed (like we saw). IAAPA 2022 Zamperla announces new Lightning Trains which will debut on an all new reimagined TT2 coming to Cedar Point Spring 2024.

In terms of why would CP announce it originally in 2022 when they had already announced The Boardwalk? Well 1. I don't know for sure that they would have announced at IAAPA 2022 along with the new lightning trains I just think it would have made sense and 2. they target completely different audiences so I doubt that announcing both would have that large of an impact on people deciding to wait a year to visit the park.

Interesting video from Ryan the Ride Mechanic on TT2:

Care to share the highlights?

Highlights, at least to me - I really like this guy as he is not about making predictions or having "sources" but rather focuses on his experience in the industry to say what he thinks is going on. Also, he calls the new company Cedar Flags which is my desired name for the new company.

Most of this video focuses on the side to side movement of the trains, he also mentions that the side to side movement is partially caused by the lack of lateral supports on the launch track and people moving along with the ride when it is in operation. Those combined put more strain on the trains than they were designed to handle and will need to be replaced. In the end the higher center of gravity due to the taller trains is an/the issue.

His thought is that there will be new or at least highly modified trains next season with a "beefier" chassis. He also mentions that the 3D track inspection was most likely so they could plug all data from a new train design into a new CAD design. The issues most likely extend beyond what new trains can solve and the track itself might need some modifications.

Main points are:

• New Trains.
• Re-profiling the turns on the top hat to reduce the intensity of the spirals.
• Additional track supports.

A lot of what he said support the most credible rumors that I have heard about the status of the ride and also match up with the timeline and events that we were able to observe at the park.

I think JUnderhill covered the main points.

I like Ryan the Mechanic's video and tone. He's not sensational or seeking click bait -- just using his experience as a ride mechanic (I believe it was at Six Flags Discovery Kingdom or whatever that park in Vallejo, California is called) to make informed guesses as to what is going on -- and he is very clear in stating what's speculation.

The only part that was mildly surprising (although less so in retrospect) is his suspicion there may be modifications to the curvature on the top hat and downward spiral. To an uninformed non-engineer, that doesn't seem like a minor thing to do, but maybe somewhat "extending" those curves to lower forces is not as big of a deal as it seems.

If that transpires, I feel immensely jealous of those precious few who got to ride TT2 with full speed over that top hat and whipping down the spiral -- I heard it was an amazing ride experience. I really hope it's not diminished too much, IF anything is done to those forces.

I hope Lake Erie Lifestyles changes their name and starts flying drones again in the offseason. Need to see what cranes they bring in.

veritas55:

I feel immensely jealous of those precious few who got to ride TT2 with full speed over that top hat and whipping down the spiral -- I heard it was an amazing ride experience.

Meh, not really IMO. The whip down the spiral was incredibly uncomfortable, since the higher seat height made the inline roll of TTD into more of a hardcore barrel roll on TT2, and not in a desirable way. Additionally, the LSM launch on TT2 didn't feel nearly as intense/exciting as it looked; there just wasn't that "kick" of torque to the start of TT2's launch that LSM launches are capable of doing (e.g., Maverick's tunnel launch), so it felt really drawn out and less intense. Not to mention the lateral swaying/shaking; I somehow managed to get a back car/back seat ride each of the 3 (maybe 4, can't remember) times I rode, and in each case the swaying/shaking was terrifying, in a "they're closing TT2 down for an overhaul? What a surprise! /sarcasm" kind of way. I will give you that the top hat's negative G's were impressive, and I will admit that the reverse acceleration in the swing launch was really wild. At the same time, however, TT2 as it initially opened, for me at least, was so-so. The additions were interesting, but the flaws kind of cancelled out what had been added. To make a long story short (too late!), don't feel too bad that you missed it; again, just my opinion, but I think you didn't really miss out on much, given the flaws, and it'll be even better once they fix those flaws.

Personally, I have never been a fan of the spiraling down the top hat, even on TTD.

I wonder if that was a choice in the original design, or somehow was a necessary component of the engineering.

bootymix96:

The whip down the spiral was incredibly uncomfortable

This 100%. While I enjoyed my 2 rides on TT2, I noticed I bruised my arm pretty good from being thrown rather harshly into the overhead lap bar support (not sure what to call it…the unpadded part that comes down from above the headrest and contains the lap bar). I guess being the old man that I am, bruising on coasters isn’t as much fun as it was back in 1992 when I came off 12 consecutive rides on Drachen Fire with a tennis ball-sized bruise/contusion on my left elbow. 🤷🏻‍♂️

Curious to see what they do with the ride in the off season and if the re-reimagined version can be a success. Again, I thought overall the ride was a blast so I hope they can work out the issues for more people to be able to enjoy it.

Adding some lateral supports to the launch track seems like a relatively straight forward fix. Re-profiling the track 420' in the air is decidedly less so and I'm sure is absolutely the last resort here.

Phew.... I now feel better about missing out on the original incarnation.

It just seemed like the negative G at the top of the top hat and that insane spiral would be an incredible moment.

But maybe not so much (for some)....

The re-profiling of the turns on the top hat would definitely be the last resort, there were interesting thoughts and commentary on why that could be necessary though. None of this was presented as fact or this is what will happen, just thoughts on what is going on and what it could take to fix it.

RTRM's speculation is interesting to me, as he has actual experience with this stuff and I don't, and some of his thoughts are similar to what I had been pondering. I believed that we would see a major train redesign as opposed to a patchwork series of fixes, and I also had wondered about both adding lateral supports to the launch track and top hat pullout, and I had also wondered if they might need to reprofile the turn/twist on the tophat based on rider comments combined with the higher position relative to the track with the lightning trains. It will be very interesting to see what transpires over the off-season, and I don't think a reprofile is all that far fetched.

Maverick00:

Personally, I have never been a fan of the spiraling down the top hat, even on TTD.

Right there with you. In fact, I think it took away from the experience into an odd and somewhat uncomfortable descent instead of just enjoying falling from 420 feet in the air.

I feel like they added the spiral just to add an element to a 17 second experience, since you can't add much to a 17 second experience.

Removing the downward spiral would be a big improvement.

I always wondered if, at the time, they might've thought that 420 feet straight down was too much, and they put the spiral in there to gently heartline you into your seat or something.

At any rate, after all of this, I'm starting to buy the company line that Maverick's heartline roll was too much stress on the train. I always suspected that was PR-speak for "It would've snapped necks like twigs."

I, too, would have preferred a straight drop on TTD, but, over time, I came to appreciate what an insane element it is (and how well it was designed -- it never felt uncomfortable (to me)).

I don't think Intamin believed the straight drop couldn't have worked (obviously, they did it 3 years later on KingaDa Ka), my guess is they just thought it added a more interesting experience?

Kingda Ka appears to have the same 270-degree spiral after the tophat that TTD had. Looking at POVs of both rides shows this if I'm seeing it correctly. Now check out Red Force. After the tophat, the train negotiates just a 90-degree turn. Both manuevers reposition the train correctly for the descent. The 270-degree spiral just takes the scenic route. The 90-degree turn would be more desirable for those who don't like the spiral.