Winter at Cedar Point

Just Coasting said:

...remember Christmas is for the kids!!!!!!

That's not the true meaning of Christmas.

Anyway, about 10-15 years ago my family took a ride up to the Sandusky-Port Clinton area on a typical Ohio winter day. We stopped at Battery Park, and boy was it cold! No, it wasn't cold, it was freezing! I couldn't imagine what it could have felt like out on that peninsula. This whole idea of keeping the park open longer into December is just plain stupid and ridiculous. As others stated above, if it was successful back in 1994 they would still be doing it every year.

No, not "keeping the park open longer into December". Closing as normal and opening back up for weekends late in November and December. I'll be sure to pass along your "stupid and ridiculous" comment to the people who are making the money being open, I'm sure they'll close down immediately.

If anything isn't successful for CF in a short amount of time they scrap it. That's the management that's in place right now and I would hope going to change soon.

It will sell out for sure every year. Did you hear that Dick, it will sell out for sure every year. Lake Farm Park in Lake County Ohio does it every year and so can Cedar Point.

You're wrong.

Everything you just mentioned I can do somewhere else cheaper and closer to home.

Again, they, along with Kings Island, have tried....and it bombed. Big time.

14 years ago, so yeah, stop recollecting over a decade ago and think about the future. Or are you as short sighted as the CF management?

Once again, if another northern park does it and has great success why couldn't CP or KI? That's a rhetorical question for those of you that couldn't tell.

*** Edited 10/6/2007 3:56:18 PM UTC by Loopy***

I think the idea is nice, but it would be very difficult to make it happen. Full time employees are very busy during the off season with planning, maintenance, cleaning, etc, and it would be a lot of work to open the park back up in Nov. and Dec. It would cost CF a lot of money to do this and I'm not sure that enough locals would attend to make it worth while. All this combined with the fact that winter weather is so unpredictable here is why I think it will never happen. It would be interesting to try though.

Hersheypark has Harrisburg (and a year-round attraction next door). The Toledo Zoo has Toledo. The Columbus Zoo has Columbus.

I used to think the failure was due to a lack of effort, but I don't believe that anymore. I also don't think weather is the #1 factor.

Cedar Point easily pulls from Detroit and Cleveland during the summer, but the geographical reach for a winter event will be much smaller. With the nearest big city 50 miles away, and competing events at the zoo, etc., it makes it a much tougher sell. Even Kings Island struggled in Cincinnati.

However, as Sandusky becomes a year-round destination, I wouldn't say some type of event is out of the question in the future.

Loopy said:
Yeah, I'm sure Hershey is losing loads of money and they only charge $9.95 for admission. That is in no way related to Chocolate World either. Over 30 rides open and decorated, along with an over two mile drive through Hershey Sweet Lights. That's an additional charge but the park itself is open every day from the 13th of December all the way up 'til the 23rd. They do have weekend hours starting on the 16th of November.

You're right, there's no money to be had in that type of happening. Hershey does it out of the kindness of their hearts (which from what I've seen wouldn't surprise me). It comes down to CF not handling it properly just like many other things we've seen.

Except that HP is not located on a peninsula sticking out into a lake. That one fact makes a great deal of difference in December. Yes, you might get some good weekends, but you could lose more money on one bad weekend than you make on 2 good weekends.

Plus the point is not exactly condusive to "an over two mile drive through Hershey Sweet Lights."

I'd believe that if the temperature history of the two locations wasn't almost identical.

And who said CP had to do the same things as Hershey? I was merely pointing out that they have multiple attractions at the holidays and are VERY successful with it. Walt makes a good point, but I think the weather is still good enough early on that there's some money to be had there.

*** Edited 10/6/2007 7:28:22 PM UTC by Loopy***

Loopy said:
Walt makes a good point, but I think the weather is still good enough early on that there's some money to be had there.

"Some money" may not be enough. Like other corporations, ROI is what makes CF's heart tick. I have no idea what putting one of these things costs, but the profit margin had better be over 6% or CF is better off investing in bonds.

Obviously there will be no $$$ from the resort (except Castaway Bay and they make $$$ without it).

And if they are using full-time staff and not seasonals they have to pay overtime for every hour over 40. If they are bringing seasonals there are costs to heat dormatories.

Does this leave a return over 6%? It could be profitable, but the ROI less than leaving the money in bonds--or even paying down debt.

I didn't say that I was on the planning board for it, just that Hershey is very successful in doing something similar.

As Walt also pointed out, Sandusky is becoming a more year around destination so hopefully CF management won't be as short sighted as they have in the past.

I'm with Loopy on this. Put a real effort into it and it will work. The attempt made in the past was a joke based on what I've learned about it and I didn't even know it happened!

The Cleveland/Toledo crowd is only an hour or so away. I travel nearly that much to get to the Toledo Zoo, I don't live in Toledo. The Toledo Zoo attracts from more than Toledo, it is a regional draw and also attracts many from MI.

Create a show that will fill the resorts and the Christmas Season can be as profitable as Halloweekends. I think a lot of people are comfortable with the status quo and the excuses as to why it wouldn't work seem to be dictating things.

What I can't understand is the winter amusement park taboo that seems to be so prevelant. I don't get it. Overcome this taboo and make the place a draw and they will come. I rode MF numerous times in October when I could see my breath and loved it. The hundreds of people sharing this experience were not deterred by the cold weather. Fun is fun! :)

Wasn't Halloweekends originally an off season event? From what I can remember CP closed after Labor Day. It seems to draw bigger crowds on Halloweekend Saturdays than any day I've been there in the summer. They took the leap and it seemed to pay off.

It is also much more fun in the park when the temperature isn't so oppressive.

Besides, with 90 degree days in October, who knows what December holds? :)

I tried to cut and paste here and it didn't take...:)
*** Edited 10/7/2007 2:40:36 AM UTC by Mean People Suck***

When I was a kid in the Cleveland area, hitting 90 in July was something to talk about. With global climate change happening as we speak, as far as weather goes, Christmas in the park (when it happens) will be equivalent to Halloweekends when it started. :)

Mean People Suck said:

The Cleveland/Toledo crowd is only an hour or so away. I travel nearly that much to get to the Toledo Zoo, I don't live in Toledo. The Toledo Zoo attracts from more than Toledo, it is a regional draw and also attracts many from MI.

Create a show that will fill the resorts and the Christmas Season can be as profitable as Halloweekends. I think a lot of people are comfortable with the status quo and the excuses as to why it wouldn't work seem to be dictating things.

What I can't understand is the winter amusement park taboo that seems to be so prevelant. I don't get it. Overcome this taboo and make the place a draw and they will come. I rode MF numerous times in October when I could see my breath and loved it. The hundreds of people sharing this experience were not deterred by the cold weather. Fun is fun! :)

The taboo is one thing, overcoming cold snow & ice is another.

When you have beautiful 65 and 70 degree days Halloweekends sell out. Friday nights. . .not so much. Apparently people prefer not seeing their breath on MF on Saturday afternoons than seeing their breath o MF after dark on Friday nights.

People will not spend 6-12 hours outside on 40 degree days, and they are not likely to drive two hours (1 each way) to spend three hours at a "Christmas Fest." And if there is snow or ice on the roads (rarely a problem between Memorial Day & Labor Day) they will drive even less.

Not to mention people are rarely busy Christmas shopping in July. December, however, is another matter.

MF in October and MF in December.

With the nearest big city 50 miles away, and competing events at the zoo, etc., it makes it a much tougher sell.

Spot on, Walt.

Im not saying that I wouldnt enjoy it, Im just saying I would never drive from Columbus to do it.

There is absolutely nothing Cedar Point could do in the winter that I could not do here in Columbus. In fact, I would argue that the zoo could pull off a x-mas event better than Cedar Point ever could.

None of you have suggested any ideas that would make me say "hey honey, that sounds great and unique...lets drive 3 hours to see that!"

And that's what it would take.

Captain Hawkeye said:

The taboo is one thing, overcoming cold snow & ice is another.

When you have beautiful 65 and 70 degree days Halloweekends sell out. Friday nights. . .not so much. Apparently people prefer not seeing their breath on MF on Saturday afternoons than seeing their breath o MF after dark on Friday nights.

People will not spend 6-12 hours outside on 40 degree days, and they are not likely to drive two hours (1 each way) to spend three hours at a "Christmas Fest." And if there is snow or ice on the roads (rarely a problem between Memorial Day & Labor Day) they will drive even less.

Not to mention people are rarely busy Christmas shopping in July. December, however, is another matter.

MF in October and MF in December.

Snow and ice is easy to overcome, we do it in our own yards all winter. So does Wal Mart, the mall, the zoo, the art museum, etc. and any other "public" place.

People flock to the Toledo Zoo in the winter during the Lights Before Xmas as much as they do in the summer. Temperature is irrelevant, it's the attraction that counts. Build it and they will come.

People routinely spend several hours outside in the winter at many winter festivals (at least I do). Not to mention all those boobs that love skiing, sledding, etc. for hours in the cold. What about all those lunatics on Times Square or at the Browns games when the high is 0 F (did it, been there)?

People drive in all kinds of weather to get somewhere whether shopping at the mall or home for Xmas.

People also find time to entertain themselves as well as have time to shop for xmas.

In 2006, most of December was warmer than most days I spent at the point in October, except for a cold spell early in the month. But in general you are correct, you can't compare Oct. to Dec. However, when did anyone make this comparison? If I ride MF and it is 37 F in October, how is this different if I ride MF and it is 37 F in December? And who were all those loony birds that were riding with me? Obviously they don't know when to stay home, tooo cooold :).

If the attraction is great, the crowds will follow. I think that there is a lot of opportunity being missed at CP during the off season. That's just my humble opinion.

In the end, it doesn't matter what you or I think, I doubt anything would ever go beyond Halloweekends anyhow. But if it did, I'd be there.

In additon to the mistake at Hershey park, do ya suppose these German fruit cakes don't know what the heck they are doing too? The climate pretty much mirrors NW OH and yet they have coasters running as well as other attractions.

Europa Park Web Site

http://www.europapark.de/lang-en/c261default.html

Check out all those santas freezing their buts off on that coaster. Fun is fun! :)

Please have fun. That's just my humble request!

My non-coaster friends that grew up in Cincinnati LOVED Winterfest. They went every year and were really sad when it went away. They said it was always packed too. So, I'm not sure why that wasn't successful unless it was just managed poorly.

I can see Sandusky not being close enough to a large center of the population to attract visitors like they do in the summer. But, we used to drive all the way to Oglebay in WV for their winter fest thing, so people will drive if the draw is there. With Castaway Bay there, they do have a place for people to stay overnight, too.

I'm thinking if you want to try a winter event at a theme park, you need to budget for at least several years of operation. Things like that are a lot based on tradition. So, you need to give it a couple years to catch on. Canceling it after one season doesn't seem very smart to me.