Wildwater Kingdom and Advertising

Thank you Evita Smith....

Sadly, I just can't see WWK lasting past this season. All the trip reports I've seen have said the place was dead. I know if I lived in the area I would go but I am not going to drive all the way there just for a water park. Besides CP is ten times closer.

Are we really even in the peak season for water parks yet? Summer only began 3 days ago, and schools were still getting out last week. Sounds like a lot of rushed judgment to me.

I'm not a big fan of the current regime, but assuming just for a fanciful moment that GL had measurable impact on Cedar Point's bottom line as "competition," that buying it and running it for years at a loss and selling it would really make up for the loss to the "competition" pre-acquisition? No math could ever explain that. Time to let the conspiracy theory go.

I live not far from WWK and When it was GL i went up at least twice a week because that was something to do in the summer but now its WWK and i dont plan on going once this year one reason i like rides not just water and i dont want to look at the eye sore across the lake where i had so many great times over the years

I would have an easier time believing that they will hold on to WWK indefinitely in order for one of Kinzel's own to have a "safe" place to work than they bought the ride park with every intention of closing it.

Even IF they realized IMMEDIATELY that buying Geauga Lake was a mistake...I think Kinzel's pride would have kept him from taking drastic measures. I think it was ONLY after the Paramount purchase that Dick saw a way out without losing too much face.

But, that is just my uneducated guess.

I expected Wildwater Kingdom to do well since when I went to Geauga Lake last year the waterpark was PACKED while the rides side had about 40 people. I walked on to the front row of every single coaster but I had to wait 45 minutes to ride the big funnel slide.

Soak City is AWFUL. If I wanted to go to a water park I would drive the extra 45 minutes to go to a decent one. Soak City is just not worth the price of admission.

It is all about what you like. If I paid full price admission for Soak City and only got the two lazy rivers I would consider that money well spent.

But if Cedar Fair had no intention of closing the park down in time in order to remove the competition, which I admit sounds silly, why would then spend millions (around $120 million I believe) for a park that was suffering?...and then proceed to remove one of the most appealing elements.. the animals? Nothing like discouraging a big portion of your target audience. What a horrible buy!!! Did they really ever have a solid business plan for this park? Spend $120 million and turn it into a water park that is good, but not great. I hope they get a ton of dough for the land because they will need to after this mess.

Ugh... they didn't remove the damn animals. They weren't part of the sale. Six Flags took them or sold them. Besides, if they were so swell, Six Flags wouldn't have bailed in the first place.

Jeff is correct. About the only thing left of the sea life park was an aquarium. They took the performing dolphins, whales, etc. I think the sharks were left, some of the sea lions (but not the performing ones) and so forth. It was a shell (pardon the pun) of a sea life park when Six Flags left.

I also believe there were some issues when Six Flags was there about whatever permitting/approvals are necessary to add another Orca. They had the one they got from Mexico (I think) but never got permission to get another. I think I have my story straight there...but Jeff can probably add more.

Yeah, there were a lot of regulatory issues that Six Flags was not making any headway on, and having an orca by itself seems generally regarded as bad by marine biologist types. They're social animals. If Six Flags, who already had such animals out west couldn't get it done, you sure as hell better believe that Cedar Fair couldn't.

Jeff...maybe "remove" was the wrong word in the context I used. I understand CF had no interest in the marine animals. They overpaid for a struggling and poorly-maintained amusement park, and as a result of the sale, the animals would be removed. Paying that king of money and knowing you would basically close half the park was horrible logic. Granted Six Flags was not Sea World, but there was a large target audience that would still come out to see marine animals. That audience left overnight with the sale. So why buy the park when you know that segment is not going to be there?

To me the buy would be similar if Home Depot bought Sears Hardware and then removed the Craftsman products Sears is known for.

Over paid? Are you kidding? The purchase price was $145 million. The steel coasters alone were worth $50 million, the relocated rides probably worth several million more, and they still get to run a water park. If the sale of the land goes well, they could easily be at a break-even position.

I've got news for you... the audience wasn't there to begin with. Why do you think Six Flags sold the place?

I was there when it was still owned by Six Flags. And let me tell you the sea life park was as dead as the ride side. I remember going to Sea World as a young boy about 15 yeas ago. That place was packed on a wednesday. It was busy from open to close. I remember going next door to GL and it also was packed on a wednesday from open to close. The two were both managed great. Now When Six Flags came in and said oh look what we can do Maybe we can make a huge profit by selling one admition for both. But they Failed because Six Flags as a whole is a horribly managed company. lets face it Six Flags sucks. Yea they got parks world wide but not all the time dose that mean they are great. They could not compete with Cedar Point or for that matter Kings Island. So they sold. Cedar Fair did not buy the park thinking now lets close this sucker. No they bought it thinking we can do something with this. That is why you got the new water park. They were hoping on bringing in a bigger crowd. But ultimately Six Flags destroyed a tradtiton.

^^^ sorry about my rambiling jeff... This is just a relly touchy subject as it is for others i would expect..

For what its worth. Soak City is better than Michigan's Adventure's waterpark.

Soak City has free tubes and cheaper lockers than MIA. I have every reason to go to Soak City.
Michigan's Adventure's lazy river is more like the lonely unthemed river.

It's got a bend in the river that has nothing but gravel on the island. Looks like hell.

All the rides you need a tube on at MiAdv are free. My only complaint is that the Tornado doesn't have a conveyor belt.

Jeff: a $50 million value for the four relocated steel coasters is a pretty generous figure. Sure, when they were new they were worth about that, but who is going to pay full value for used coasters, especially with the outrageous relocation costs involved? I read that Kings Island (CF) spent $10 million in the '06-'07 offseason ...most of that had to be relocating Firehawk. The fifth steel coaster in the picture is Head Spin, but that template ride has little true value, and we know what the Double Loop sold for in scrap.

Also, I would agree with your statement if they took advantage of an inherited water park, but they scraped the existing one and pumped $25 million to build a new atmosphere/attractions and to relocate Thunder Falls ($20 million the first season then another $5 million for the wave pool the next year). So, their $145 million investment became $170 million. Deducting the value of the water park, the used ride value (minus the relo costs) and auction sales, I hope you are right that the land for sale is worth enough to break even.

^ CF took a $54.9m write down for "restructuring" Geauga Lake. That means they anticipate coming up $54.9m short, not breaking even.