Gates.

With the addition of Gates to Iron Dragon a season ago, and with the addition of them to Magnum this season, do you like what CP is doing, or dislike it, cause wih every passing season, I have heard adds another ride that will get gates.....

*** This post was edited by coastermaina on 4/15/2002. ***

Whats really to like or dislike about it when ya think hard about it? Saftey is the name of the game....Doesn't bother me one bit to be honest. Theres some Morons out there who don't like to follow rules..ya can thank them for this trend!

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http://www.msu.edu/~armbrus9/cp.html
Fear the Mullet!

I would have to say that I agree with the fact that CP is following state legislation.

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Gemini Speedball 2002
www.geocities.com/freddieneo

I agree with the gates. I don't think it's as much as the morons who don't follow rules as much as it's kids who are so excited to see the train coming in and lean over to see it come in. I've seen that many times, it gets me nervous every time too. I'm sure there are hundred different reason why they need gates I think that when you really think about them, all of them are really good.

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- Chris -
http://www.thepointol.com/~simplycp

Like I said though..Does it really matter one way or the other? I mean do the gates on Milly really bother us peeps?.... To me Not one bit!

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http://www.msu.edu/~armbrus9/cp.html
Fear the Mullet!

Who said it was state legislation. RideMan? I know you've got the skinny on this... what's the dillyo?

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Jeff
Webmaster/GTTP, Sillynonsense.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"

Gates are not bad at all. It is just another form of control for anxious kids or adults who can't follow rules. It iws top protect teh park patrons, the ride ops from dealing with an accident and probably getting sued, and to protect the park. No one wants to see an accident and this is one of the most unobtrusive safeguards in place.

If you go to parks across the country, you will see how common they are becoming.

It's been a while since I found out, so I don't remember the exact language that was used. I can't quote you chapter and verse, but I can cite authority. I was chatting with John Dodson from the Ohio Department of Agriculture at IAAPA, and he indicated that Ohio's ride rules are changing. As Ohio's lead state ride inpsector, I suppose he ought to know. I don't remember if the effective date was to be 2003 or 2004, but the change is that instead of requiring that the parks adhere to "manufacturer's specifications" they are going to increase the requirements to "ASTM standards." This is why you're seeing more and more ASTM-compliant (42" high, within 2" of the surface, rejects a 4" ball) at Cedar Point not only on new construction but also on older rides (for instance the changes to the railing on the uptrack entrance stairway on Gemini).

I don't think the use of queue gates is specifically addressed in the ASTM standards (sorry, they're not on-line) and I think one critical issue is one of at what point riders are "on the ride" and where the fence needs to be. But the need for fencing is spelled out in the standards, and if the rider is not 'on the ride' he needs to be protected from the ride by a fence. That's what the standard says. So it looks like Cedar Point will be installing a whole bunch of gates in the next few years. Given the other changes made to the platforms, I'm surprised we haven't yet seen them on Mine Ride and Corkscrew yet.

No, I don't like them. Yes, I think that as usually implemented, they are themselves a non-trivial hazard. But like it or not, that's the way things are going.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

I'll chime in and say that I, like Rideman, believe gates cause more harm than they prevent. In theory, the gates prevent the worst disaster of someone falling into the track and being runover by the train. However, in reality, with an alert crew (usually with 2 or 3 people on the load side), the chances of someone being runover by a train are extremely minimal as they first have to get up to the track, stepping like 5 feet or more over the yellow line, and getting by the ops watching. Even in the worst case of yellow line violators, they really aren't all that close to the track. Also, even after getting up to the track, they have to either step down into or fall into the track. Even if this happens, it is usually as simple as the control op lifting up on dispatch to stop the incoming train. My point is that there are many things that have to happen in order for someone to fall into the track and be injured by an incoming train. My theory is that if they have gates on the load side, they better have them on the unload side too (I think Apollo's Chariot at BGW has this) to prevent the little kid from running up the exit to greet his mommy on the incoming train. I saw that happen twice last year, but I never saw any close calls on the load side.

By the same token, it does not take all that much for a guest not really being alert to be injured by the air gates. They are usually designed so that they allow enough space for fingers, but not bodies or even arms or legs. If someone is in the way of a closing gate, they could get hurt. Ridman makes a good point when he says "that as usually implemented, they are themselves a non-trivial hazard." There are ways to implement gates where they will be much less hazardous. A spring loaded system with a locking mechanism has been discussed at Coasterbuzz and would make a lot more sense. I haven't seen it, but Talon supposedly has such a system.

Add to this the fact that on a ride like Magnum or especially Gemini, the ops need every second they have to get that train ready to go out. The gates (again as usually implemented) open slow and do cause a few seconds delay. I don't think they'll cause too much of a problem on Magnum, but I'm betting that when gates come to Gemini, they'll never be able to run 6 trains again unless they come up with a better system.

As big of a deal as I can make of this, Spartan has a point that as a guest, it really doesn't matter one bit whether there are gates there or not. It's not something worth getting all stressed over. :)

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-Matt
2001 Magnum Crew