Top Thrill Dragster 2022 Status

vwhoward's avatar

DJ, I live in Bay City. About 2 hours from Detroit Proper. I am a little confused though...I-69 is not near me or Midland. Midland is about a 10 minute drive. Wait, you also consider Flint "Metro Detroit"? It's not even close to Detroit. I would argue that one with you all day. And i go to Detroit a lot. 🤣

Jeff, Southern Michigan is Detroit or maybe Flint and south. I live in what we would call Mid-Michigan. Anything north of me, Bay City, is definitely north. The UP is the UP. Flat out. You don't say you're going up north if you're going over the bridge. You say you're going to the UP. Also, if you consider the entire mitten, then you're closet to right than I previously thought. But you just don't know what to call us! Ha!

Last edited by vwhoward,

Joe
Eat 'em up, Tigers, eat 'em up!

I think anytime there’s a new attraction or construction site at the park, logic and common sense goes out the window in the enthusiast community.

If by now you can’t see the direction the park is taking with regard to new investments then I’m not sure what else to say. They do not need the worlds tallest or fastest anything anymore. They had record attendance again this season and that was without Wicked Twister and TTD. Pretty sure that says it all.

And while I don’t live in Florida I am a UOAP and even I know it’s ridiculous to even try and draw comparisons between theme parks and Cedar Point.

Given the walls that went up today this is far more than just “new trains” or “new paint”. Heck even the ride sign itself is gone. That’s pretty telling to me. But then again I’m just using the powers of observation.

Last edited by mgou58,

A crazy idea just occurred to me. Could they have hired a different company (B&M et. al.) to update the entire ride (track, launch, ...), and just utilize the old tower? If we see track removed from the tower, then I would say this option is likely. Since they didn't say anything about this in the 2023 announcement, then I wonder if this is a bigger project than one off season?

Last edited by 0g,
Cedar Pointer's avatar

There is a meaningful difference between "Must" and "seems likely." Most, if not all, arguments are really just over the definitions of words. Using "Your arguing semantics" is like pulling the escape hatch instead of just addressing what was said. Jeff it feels like you are arguing with positions that we don't have. None of us know what the park is going to do. Whatever they do will be a big investment. If thats replacing the launch, adding to the layout, or taking the tower down, all will cost a crazy amount of money. Sometimes its fun to dream. (if i dont get my 500ft aquatrax i will burn down a lemon chill stand)

I agree with you! Cedar Point is moving away from maintenance nightmares to restaurants. Im pumped with the boardwalk addition. I love all the improvements to food in the park. To me its up to the quick service standard at some of the Disney parks.


The Crystal Method is the only way to find The Winner!

It’s 💯 % fun to dream. It’s why we have all gathered to this place over the last 23 years. Jeff- thank you for this space. We’re all just overly obsessed with a theme park in Sandusky, Ohio and it’s fun to debate, discuss, probe, question, point out each other’s logical fallacies- whatever it is.

I truly enjoy hearing each other’s thoughts. If my ideas pin me as a fanboy playing roller coaster tycoon in my mother’s basement, well I’ll take it and wear the badge proudly- it’s certainly better than trying to discuss this on social media. That’s something we can all agree on 😉

Chuck Wagon's avatar

I seem to recall from Winter Chill Outs in the past that the maintenance team described all of the Intamin trains as being overly complicated.

I wonder if the park would have at least called Mack and asked them to assess what they could do with the ride.

If they do not drastically alter the ride experience, this is still a chance to correct some other things, like being designed for 6 trains but only running 5 from day one.


-- Chuck Wagon --
aka Pagoda Gift Shop

I still think a repaint, retheme, rename and LSM swap with new trains is the likliest outcome. 3 car trains like Red Force would be iffy for capacity, however.


CP Coaster Top 10: 1. Steel Vengeance (40 rides to date) 2. Top Thrill Dragster (191 launches to date, 4 rollbacks) 3. Magnum XL 200 4. Millennium Force 5. Maverick 6. Raptor 7. GateKeeper 8. Valravn 9. Rougarou 10. Gemini

While CP is in a pretty tough spot here re:TTD, the whole announcement struck me as odd. What if all they are doing is buying time?

Hear me out…

What if they are only testing the waters of the general consensus to make the decision to rehab/rebrand vs. tear out further down the road ?

I’m sure projects like this require extensive planning and stunning levels of details to consider. So maybe they simply haven’t decided yet.

On one hand, I don’t think they want to be seen as somehow excited or otherwise celebrating a new ride at the same time lowering the TTD flag down the pole (out of respect for the acc. Victim). On the other hand, they could very well be ripping it out with a completely new ride and didn’t want the negative press involved while they hype Halloweekends and ‘23 passes.

As far as where people are from to otherwise gauge CP’s stature in the amusement industry I say “who cares where people are from?”. To somehow make a case that because CP draws heavily locally somehow denigrates them I don’t understand. In fact it could be argued that CP knows it’s “base” and has done a great job of pandering to the locals (gold pass, new sports center, purchase/upgrade sawmill, etc).

And as far as pointing to record profits while having one of your iconic rides down as justification that CP doesn’t “need” TTD is wrong. CP needs to continuously staying in front of the curve re: the cutting edge of rides. As soon as you look away for a second, your competition has left you in the dust.

Pretty much everything that Intamin built is way more complicated than it needs to be. Just look at their interpretation of Shoot the Rapids. Such rides were built prior to the turn of the 20th century with nary the issues that this ride had. Their desire to have everything be proprietary to them is legendary in the business, and not in a good way.

It wasn't even a part of the train that failed. The flag plate on the train *hit something*. Repeatedly. When an irresistible force collides with an immovable object, something is going to give. What gave was the two bolts holding the flag plate to the train, after something on the track had been hammering on it all day long. That something was banging into a part of the train was the real failure.

I've thought of a concept that I think makes sense for a total re-theme, eliminates the flying debris hazard (overblown as it is) for people waiting in line, requires *no* changes to the ride system itself, and includes a nice nod to park history. But I think I'll keep it to myself for the moment...

For now I'll just watch as Cedar Point starts to look like Disneyland with construction walls everywhere.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.



/X\ *** Respect rides. They do not respect you. ***
/XXX\ /X\ /X\_ _ /X\__ _ _____
/XXXXX\ /XXX\ /XXXX\_ /X\ /XXXXX\ /X\ /XXXXX
_/XXXXXXX\_/XXXXX\_/XXXXXXX\_/XXX\_/XXXXXXX\__/XXX\__/XXXXXX

I don’t know if Cedar Point is the ultimate destination, or if all roads lead there, but I will say that in many ways it hits a gold standard in the industry. My first visit was as a kid in the early 60’s when the park was “new”. I’ve watched the place my entire life and feel like we kind of grew up together. Well, at least I’ve seen it all come and go, sometimes for the better and sometimes not.
I beg to differ when someone insists that Cedar Point has always taken a concept and perfected it by applying superlatives. Examples where that was just not the case include Mean Streak, Avalanche Run, Mantis, Iron Dragon, Top Thrill Dragster, and even White Water Landing. And don’t get me wrong, they are/were all fun rides and have been enjoyed by millions. But each suffered in its own way because someone felt like setting a record was the way to market a ride in order to, in turn, get more people through the gate. Smaller, slower, shorter rides exist in those styles that provide better thrills and reliability.
And to be fair, many times Cedar Point absolutely made it work. Magnum, Raptor, Millennium Force, Corkscrew, Gemini, and Maverick all came along at the right time and at a pace that set an enviable standard. And all but one of those eventually had it’s record setting features eclipsed anyway.
TTD falls into the category of disappointing failure simply because it was over ambitious in size and technology. When it was good it was very very good, but when it was bad…

A “reimagining”, especially in this case, needs to be done carefully- a Disaster Transport type of re-do here won’t fool anyone and would be a serious mistake. It would still be known to the industry, enthusiasts, and the public as the ride that was plagued with unacceptable downtime that ultimately tried to kill someone which led to it’s final undoing. I’m not sure how it’s going to happen, but both of those major flaws absolutely need to be corrected in order for the project to be successful. No doubt it will take money and maybe lots of it. But it will also take creativity and a change in technology.
I’ve resigned myself to the fact that I’ll never again take one of the most thrilling coaster experiences I’ve ever had, but I also can’t wait to see whatever comes along next.

djDaemon's avatar

I'm not sure what I expected, but the perimeter of the fencing is further out than I would imagine would be needed for a relatively simple modification. Or maybe not, who knows.

But the timing is interesting, as they are wasting no time getting things moving. While not trivial, "merely" replacing the launch system with LSM would presumably not require such swift action, even if the modified ride were slated to open in 2023.

vwhoward:

DJ, I live in Bay City. About 2 hours from Detroit Proper. I am a little confused though...I-69 is not near me or Midland. Midland is about a 10 minute drive. Wait, you also consider Flint "Metro Detroit"?

Like I said, it depends on who you ask. :-) I don't necessarily consider Flint as part of Metro Detroit, just that most of everything SE of it could, by some, be considered part of it. If there were a better or more commonly known landmark to cite between Flint and Detroit, I would choose it instead. But not many people are familiar with Clarkston, for example, which might better define the boundary.

Last edited by djDaemon,

Brandon

vwhoward's avatar

I agree with Clarkston. I would say Pine Knob starts The outskirts of Detroit. Exit 101, Grange Hall Rd, is just the best convenience store I've ever been to yet not really much around it. Sashabaw Rd, Exit 89, Pine Knob, that's where things start to get busy. Flint is an hour north of the D.


Joe
Eat 'em up, Tigers, eat 'em up!

Cedar Pointer's avatar

I grew up off exit 101. When people ask where I’m from I say Metro Detroit. It’s easier to explain then the township of Holly. I would consider most anything south east to be metro Detroit.


The Crystal Method is the only way to find The Winner!

I live in the S.E. corner of Michigan, about 10 miles north of Toledo and south of Monroe. We Don't consider ourselves part of metro Detroit.

In a surprising twist of events Intamin has removed TTD from their website.

djDaemon's avatar

I grew up camping at Groveland Oaks at least once a summer in the 80's and 90s, and used to go to RenFest occasionally, so I'm definitely familiar with exit 101.


Brandon

Cedar Pointer's avatar

Skydiver - That’s a good point. Not the whole south east. Thanks for the clarification.

djDaemon - it was a good place to grow up. Love the small town vibe. Close enough to pine knob for concerts, close enough to Detroit for baseball. Life is good on 75


The Crystal Method is the only way to find The Winner!

Kevinj's avatar

If you listen closely, you can hear my voice. 2nd tenor, 3rd from the left in the 2nd row.

And yes, it would seem that TTD is no longer an Intamin product. According to Intamin.

Last edited by Kevinj,

Promoter of fog.

I said earlier I said it again. A simple LSM + Train upgrade with retheme does not count as “gone as you know it” Or “new ride experience”. Especially when arguing what the GP is going to consider a new ride experience. If you paint it and keep it top hat only 99% of the GP is going to look at it and go “this is the same ride with a new name” and not be able to tell you other than a potentially different train what is “gone as you know it” about the ride.

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